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03-20-2007, 07:52 PM
| #11 |
| Banned Supreme Forum King  |  Yeah Bob! I was going back to the article to get more detail on resourses for Tom and just happen to see the link about that movie!! What a great way to show Tom what I was talking about!! Hope he can get it! Glad you like (like I do!). Thank you. |
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03-21-2007, 06:05 AM
| #12 | |
| Registered User Forum King | Quote:
Thanks for that, the video showed exactly what I was expecting as it was exactly the same method they used in the previous article with the design I submitted. That would have made it very clear to anyone wishing to rout a dish that depth. There was some mention in one of the postings that it was completed with the router in the plunge mode well that was not really the case as the band saw was used to cut the external surface then a sander was used to finish it off, and finally the base was rounded over in the router table. My concern is that the rough material could have been removed first with a straight cutter as it is easier to control the router with a straight cutter rather than a large Dish cutter. The cutter had to be larger than the diameter of the Chuck (Collet) of course. Also using the dish cutter to rout out so much of the waste material by the time it got to produce the final cut it could be requiring sharpening. If I were to do the project first I would have to purchase a suitable extension. I would make the template that little bigger (There is a need to workout the 'offset' to increase the size.) I would secure the material to a simple jig within a simple jig holder. Harrysin has shown in previous postings a modified holder he was using to accommodate the thicker material he was routing, only it was a rectangular box. The template would be made the same size as the Jig Holder (No need to screw it down) I would also Rout the outside edge to produce a wall thickness that was constant in width. There is no way that cutting with the band saw will produce the desired results. To achieve this I would require to produce a 'plug' that would fit neatly into the dish, then with the aid of a template guide and a straight cutter I would rout in stages to the required depth. (I would not rout all the way through) Also what is very important is to achieve a straight side I would use a set of 'Skis'. I would trim of the majority of the waste material to leave a small section for trimming with the trimming cutter. To trim of the waste material screw the 'Plug' to a sacrificial board (Upside down) and again with the set of skis rout the edge. It's time I completed my DVDs Tom | |
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03-21-2007, 11:30 AM
| #13 |
| Banned Supreme Forum King | Hi Tom, I'm glad you were able to see the video OK. I agree with you on using a straight bit to cut out most of the center... finishing up with the bowl cutter (I think I mentioned that in my first post).  My VERY FIRST thought was to cut each plank BEFORE the glue-up using a jig like yours to force good registration. Any ole straight bit could be used, etc. with a template and guide bushing. Then glue them together and finish it with the Bowl cutter with extension, etc. ... I just thought that the outside trim could also be done while unglued... that would cut down on a lot of extra work... wouldn't it? What do you think of the unglued approach? I'm not sure what you have against the bandsaw, sanding, & routing the edges... Harry did the same thing except it was just bottom 'holding' strip he cut with the bandsaw after routing down the outside edge. Is the bandsaw off limits? If you like the routed cut finish, why not cut the biggest part off with the bandsaw, then go to the router to finish it up...? ... leaving only a small amount of router cutting. Good luck on your DVD's. |
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03-21-2007, 04:34 PM
| #14 |
| Senior Moderator Supreme Forum King  | Joe, the answer about the band saw is this: The router will give you a nice clean finish from the start so why make the additional step of using the bandsaw? By the same token your way makes sense too. There is more than one way to complete this project and we will never get everyone to agree on a single method. Lets just call it a difference of opinion and leave it at that.
__________________ Mike |
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03-22-2007, 03:22 AM
| #15 |
| Forum Contributer Supreme Forum King  | The "routed" bowl Thanks Mike for bringing some sanity into this "discussion" I get the distinct impression that guys with no actual experience of a particular method have very firm beliefs in which is the correct one! Tom, and myself have for years used the old methods, (we are both into our seventies) but Tom has developed better methods for carring out various routing proceedures and these methods have been refined over the years.I and I'm sure Tom do not expect everyone to drop methods that they have used for years, but to just try them,there could be some surprises! My routed box with lid is ready for posting but my computer is in hopital,I'm using my wifes' machine for this post and it doesn't have my photographs.Harry |
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03-22-2007, 03:42 AM
| #16 |
| Forum Contributer Supreme Forum King | "safe project" Joe,regarding using a collet extension,you may recall,or re-check my post,that I purchased a half inch CMT extension at a high cost to rout my box.There are two reasons why I doubt that I shall use it again 1...It is VERY noisy,which I guess is vibration 2...I consider it to be unsafe because the cutter cannot be retracted into the router so several inches of cutter/extension are protruding from the router,hardly a SAFE method. Has anyone else had experience with these extensions,if so what are YOU'RE thoughts. Cheers Joe, Harry I just realised that I may have given the impression that I won't be routing more deep boxes, I certainly will but will settle for sharp internal corners by using a long straight cutter. Harry Last edited by harrysin; 03-22-2007 at 03:45 AM. |
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03-22-2007, 04:32 AM
| #17 |
| Registered User Forum King | "I'm not sure what you have against the bandsaw, sanding, & routing the edges... Harry did the same thing except it was just bottom 'holding' strip he cut with the bandsaw after routing down the outside edge. Is the bandsaw off limits? If you like the routed cut finish, why not cut the biggest part off with the bandsaw, then go to the router to finish it up...? ... leaving only a small amount of router cutting" Joe Certainly the band saw is not off limits. Today I was routing the chair legs using 32mm thick American Oak and there was no way I was going to use a bearing cutter and a 'Male' Template The pics I posted earlier shows the 'Female' Templates in position routing to a reasonable depth (not all the way through leaving 5 - 6mm for trimming with the router. Tom |
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03-22-2007, 04:39 AM
| #18 |
| Registered User Forum King | "... I just thought that the outside trim could also be done while unglued... that would cut down on a lot of extra work... wouldn't it? What do you think of the unglued approach?" Sorry Joe I did not complete the posting you had submitted. I do not think trimming the outside before gluing would be the answer. I see lots of problems when gluing them all together then there is the other problem of holding the material when routing out the inside. That is only my feeling on the matter Tom |
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03-22-2007, 05:03 PM
| #19 | |
| Banned Supreme Forum King |  Quote:
I was not trying to get everyone to agree to just ONE method. I was merely trying to explore some alternative methods to SOME methods, not necesarily ALL methods. I agree with you... I don't think alternative methods want to be discussed in this thread or other related threads, so why try? This thread started by just reporting a new Woodsmith article on bowl making... eventually, even a video was available to everyone so they could see all methods used in making their bowl. We can't even agree with the published methods of Woodsmith magazine!    | |
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03-22-2007, 05:56 PM
| #20 | |
| Registered User Forum King | Quote:
I know you were not trying to get everyone to agree to one method as you said you were only trying to explore alternative methods to some methods not to all methods as you say. Sorry all if I have upset any others with my reply to the published article by Woodsmith posted by Joe. I am sure we all have read an article in many magazines where we consider an alternative method would be better if it was approached from a different angle and we go ahead and change it, and this one was no exception. Because it has been published by a reputable source, does not mean we cannot comment on the procedure used. I have taken other publications and changed the method of construction of a number of projects on many occasions. I appreciate Joe bringing forward the project and then finding the video to make his explanation of construction clearer but this does not mean that is the best way to produce the boxes. I only hope that anyone going to try to produce the boxes will give careful consideration to safety awareness. I had my concerns on the depth of the box requiring the use of the 'Extender' and Harry's comments has confirmed my belief that the extender is not really the answer to the problem. I am only happy I suggested to Harry that he does not purchase the cheaper version. Any article put forward on this forum no matter where it comes from should be open to constructive criticism. (I have received many comments on what I have posted) which I accept. Nobody has to follow or use the method I use if they do not want to but at least I am offering an alternative solution to the problem. You can take it or leave it. Tom | |
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