Mike

Rolf, Woodcraft has a 100% money back guarantee on their bits. By the same token if you have used a bit and it has performed well and needs sharpening then I would not expect them to replace it with a new bit. If a bit is defective in any way or breaks then I would expect a replacement. Fair is fair.

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Mike
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Joe Lyddon

Mike,

Rockler's website clearly states

"Unconditional Guarantee!
If you are not 100% satisfied with these bits, send them back for a refund."

It appears to NOT be true... will know tomorrow...

If I were doing it, I would word it:

"If you are not 100% satisfied with these bits under normal usage, send them back for a refund." ... and I would have an asterisk (*) linking to the finer points of exactly what their Guarantee does / doesn't cover.

I think I would question Woodcraft the same way about their warranty... I think they would change their tune too...

If their wording is like the current Rockler Guarantee, it's a lifetime satisfaction guarantee against dullness, breakage, ANYTHING!!

It's what they're saying... vs what they're doing that bothers me...

They should say it like it is... and live up to it.

Not saying it like it is one way, then weasle out of it...

Mike

Joe, I think the semantics should be left to lawyers and common sense should apply. This is like the signs McDonald's had to post to say their coffee is hot. I am sick to death of this type of argument. When a product performs as it should there is no reason to penalize the merchant who sells it. A defective product should be replaced at no charge. Any tools with cutting edges wear down. They require sharpening or replacement. This applies to drill bits, saw blades, router bits, chisels, taps, scissors, cutlery and razor blades to name a few. BJ had a bit that broke and he got a replacement, no questions asked so Rockler lived up to the intent of the warranty. Bits that had normal wear and tear and required sharpening were not covered. This is reasonable. The guarantee does not state that the bit will never dull or need sharpening. If it did then the situation is changed. If it has served its intended purpose for a normal life span then you should be satisfied. And that is what the guarantee is about. When people expect a guarantee to be something other than what is intended it ends up costing everybody more money. I for one am pleased with the performance of the bits I have purchased from both Rockler and Woodcraft. I know they are not premium bits and do not expect miracles. Only old women and lawyers worry about details like this Joe, why not make more sawdust and enjoy life instead?

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Mike
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harrysin

Mike, I was very tempted to add a post similar to what you have done, however, I felt sure that I would have been vilified by the odd member or two.

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Harry

Joe Lyddon

Mike, I agree with you 100% EXCEPT. they said Unconditionally!

They qualified their guarantee...

Unconditionally, to me, means just that... without a time limit!

If one of their bits got dull, what I thought to be too fast, it should cover sharpening. Normal use dulling, I agree with you...

But, that's NOT what they say.

Joe Lyddon

OK, I just got off the phone with "Ro", Rosieland.

I explained what had happened, etc.

She told me it was for a period of 90 days, which is stated under some questions section on the website... she couldn't tell me exactly where to find the questions. I suggested that the Unconditionally Guaranteed graphic be linked to the clarifications, wherever they were... She agreed that would be a good thing to do.

When it comes to router bits, depending on the problem, they will want to look at the bit(s) to determine if there was obvious abuse, defective, etc. and they would either replace, fix, or give refund... their choice.

If a person makes it a habit of returning bits every 3 months for a refund, they will "catch on" and stop the action... possibly losing a customer.

In General, they will strive, to the best of their ability, to make the customer happy as they have done for years.

I did happen to stumble on this link... that describes their guarantee, and other things, in detail. (clicked on the Man & Gal picture on Home page)
http://www.rockler.com/faq_ordering....ctionGuarantee

So, that wraps this subject up...

It's Unconditional, subject to their fine conditions, etc. only for 90 days.
They will make you happy... if they can... as they have done in the past.

Sorry, if this has upset anyone... I had to find out... and it ballooned into more than I expected.

harrysin

Just a final word Joe, unconditional is nothing to do with time, it simply means without conditions, ie: if within the stated period you have ANY complaint then it will be addressed, ie: replaced, repaired or a refund.
As you would say Joe "end of story"
Now let us find a new one!

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Harry

Drugstore Cowboy

That's becoming a trend in retail -- 'blacklisting' --- individual customers who abuse the policy or just tightening their return policies for everyone.

Unfortunately there ARE people who will 'buy' a suit or a dress etc or a tool to wear or use for one special purpose or event -- then return it. Or pull other tricks. I dogged shoes for a couple of years for a company who garunteed our uppers would outlast the soles. And I took back more than a few pair that had obviously been sanded or ground off --.

"No good deed ever goes unpunished." Sure as a store tries to be supportive and helpful -- SOME people are determined to ruin it for the rest of us.

harrysin

Cowboy, do you realise that we have agreed THREE times in the last few days, this must mean that we are starting to understand each other's thought trains which can only be a good thing for the forum.

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Harry

herbfellows

Absolutely correct, fair is fair. Though Rockler, for their part, should have this worded better. After all, they are a large company and should have the legal talent to write a warranty correctly. i think we all know what was intended and that should rule the day.