simplenik

Good day

So, I made the "Rolling mortise jig" and the "Router lift"
And yesterday I tested it for the first time.

I started the first mortise by cranking the "Lift" up 3~4 turns and push-pull the sled and another 3~4 turns and another push-pull.

But then, I realized that actually there is no "Fence side" and I can push or pull the sled.

I ended up working simultaneously with both hands...the left hand pushing and pulling the sled and the right hand, rotating the Lift continuously...every mortise took me some 15~20 seconds (1-7/8" long and 25/32" deep).

I cannot tell how long took me to make all the 8 mortises because taking the pics (136) in-between took me much more time than all the mortising.

The jig is not limited only to "edge mortising", if you mark the mortise location, remove the "sled stops", and align the marking with the "locator", you can make it anywhere along the board.

Regards
niki

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simplenik

Mike

Niki, there is no doubt in my mind that you will always find the most difficult solution to any problem. You have some interesting ideas but I feel you over engineer at times. Here is a link to a simple jig for making mortises: http://www.routerforums.com/36915-post21.html

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Mike

simplenik

Hi Mike

Being instructor for many years, I noticed something very interesting...what looks simple to one, looks complicated to other.

I've seen many jigs on the Net, on forums and on this forum. Many of them looks to me complicated (just to get the hardware) but other people, thinks that they are "Mother of simplicity", so, it's personal

I posted the same post in other forum and here are some of the replies (just Copy/past)

"Niki that is great work and a simple approach"

"Niki, your jigs are excellent and this one is just what I need.
thanks for sharing"

"You sure you ain't half Aussie? Bloody clever old bugger, nuthin' surer."

"Niki
Cleaver ...VERY Cleaver
Every time I see a new thread that you start I know that we are all going to be in for a treat. I think that it will be near to impossible to improve on a mortise jig for simplicity and ease of setup and use. Having said that if anyone can improve on it, it will be you Niki. The way that you show it with the pictures is better than words could ever describe it.
Before I forget, Happy Birthday Niki. You're not getting older, just better and more experienced."

Regards
niki

Cassandra

Hi Mike:

I believe Niki is on the money with the "one-size-doesn't-fit-all" statement of simplicity.

Besides, niki is providing lots of valuable insight into different ways of doing things.

Let's learn from each other, eh?

Bravo, niki! Keep up the good work! I like learning from you.

Cassie

harrysin

I'm sure viewers will be disappointed if I don't give my humble opinion! As I've said in the past, Niki is a very deep thinker and a perfectionist, most of his projects really are too complex for the average woodworker to even consider attempting, take his mortice jig, how often do we use mortice and tenons, not very, so when we do, we want a quick simple jig and not want to spend more time making the jig than the project. Whilst on the subject of mortice and tennons, I see no further need for them since building my version of Niki's router lifter which has turned what used to be a nightmare of a job into something that I look forward to but, it was simple to make. So Niki please just take this as friendly CONSTRUCTIVE criticism.

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Harry

bobj3

Just My 2 Cents

" make it simple " most will not make the jigs or setups, most just want to get the job done , they want to do it the easy way....and the quick way.... turn the router on do it and be done with that part of the job....make a slot or two round and edge or two and move on..with the project, like putting it together... it's not building a rockey it's just a wood project....

Make It Simple,,,,,It was a hard for me to get that down until I watch Rick and Bob on the RWS....then you see way Bob said it all the time... and I still cache myselft doing again....not making it simple.....

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simplenik

Good morning

First, I would like to apologize if I sounded rude, in any way, in my reply to Mike, it was not my intention at all and because today is my birthday (63) I hope that I'll be forgiven... (no, I did not get new router )

But you guys are correct, it's not simple...what I did not realize or forgot is that I made "router table system" and not just Mortising jig.

It starts with the router table itself, goes through the T-Fence, the fence-bit distance positioning with the Caliper, the fence stops positioning with the "locators" and then, a special fence and roller sled for the mortising and router lift.

I would not go through all this steps just for a few mortises but, if the system is already there, the fence and the roller sled is only an "add-on", (like the box joint add-on) that took very short time to built (after my experience with the TS rolling sled and the "normal" router fence) and gives me very high accuracy.

For me, this "add on" to the existing system, is very simple. It works at the same method and accuracy as the "Doweling on router table".
I don't see any "over engineering" in some piece of "h" shape running on rollers

Interesting point...I Googled "Mortise jig" and saw many kinds of jigs. Some of them by Rockler ($300), LV and others, and some of them homemade, so, I asume that some woodworkers do need such a jigs.

The homemade ones are usually the "Horizontal router table" with two sliding tables...Would I build the "horizontal router table" for a few mortises? no way, but they did (and one Canadian guy even made it from Aluminum with bearings and cost him around $600 and he did not finish it yet) so, I believe that it depends on ones needs. Maybe the people on this forum don't need such a complicated or costly jigs but as I could see on other forums people are doing it...

Best Regards
niki

Mike

Niki & Cassie, Please do not think I was being critical of the design. It is well thought out and the results speak highly of it's ability to get the job done right. Bob and Rick have always taught us "Simple is better", and I for one have been guilty in the past of building router tables and fences that are more complex than is needed to get the job done. The more measurements you take, the more you are likely to make a mistake. I now find myself using stop blocks and set up bars for consistent results. Instead of going to the trouble of installing a T track with sliding hardware to hold a feather board I am using a clamp. These are only two examples of ways to keep things simple. Most of my life I have worked doing heavy industrial maintenance and pipe fitting, and I have a tool room mentality. The standing tool room joke is: "Let's play engineer. You design something wrong and I will make it work." A good example of this is some production welding machines I was asked to fit with hose. The engineer's specified the location of an 10" diameter air cylinder in a metal frame. They failed to take into consideration the simple fact that when installing a hose on the cylinder you had to have room to turn a wrench to tighten the fitting. It would of been a simple matter to make a small window in the 2" thick steel frame to allow for this before the machine was assembled, painted and had the electrical installed. As it was I had to build two custom wrenches to tighten the 1-1/2" hose on these machines. The sad part is this is a common thing. What all this add's up to is when I say a design is well thought out it is a compliment of the highest sort. Cassie, please do not take this as a slam against all engineer's. I have the highest respect for an engineer who spends the time to think a design all the way through. And if that design is a simple one so much the better. Different methods for accomplishing jobs is something that benefits everyone, and this forum is a wonderful place with a wide variety of ideas and I'm proud to be a part of it.

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Mike

Drugstore Cowboy

Mike's post reminds me of one of the most mis-quoted people in history (except maybe for Humphrey Bogart and Cary Grant) --- Ed Murphy Jr. -- Engineer who was working in 1949 at what is now Edwards AFB.
Yes - the originator of "Murphy's Law" which is usually stated as --
"If something can go wrong it will." ie - the universe is to blame.

As can be verified through numerous sources from the period -
Murphy was upset because someone had installed sensors on a test suit (that could only be installed TWO possible ways) the WRONG way.
What he actually said was along the lines --
"If there is a way to do something wrong {he} (naming the guilty party) will find it."
Far from excusing our errors by blaming 'fate' or chance - he was acknowledging the the universal human tendency toward error - and by implication -- the importance in designing a system (whether it's a jig or a tool or an Excel Macro or whatever) with as FEW potential points of error - as few available 'wrong' choices as possible.

And KISS is one good way to do that -

Of course -- the issue then becomes -- defining -- simple.
Ain't life GRAND!!