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Back To Mike On The MJ Splitter

This is a discussion on Back To Mike On The MJ Splitter within the Tools and Woodworking forums, part of the General Woodworking category; I'm slowiy learning. The splitter for the full kerf blade is .112", whick is .008" ...


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Old 10-04-2013, 09:31 AM   #1 (permalink)
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I'm slowiy learning. The splitter for the full kerf blade is .112", whick is .008" less than the width of a .125" thick blade. Therefore the splitter only comes in contact with the edges of the cut if the board begins to pinch, otherwise the cut is wide enough to just pass over the splitter with minimum of contact with the splitter. I say this as how I see it at the moment.

If this is true then a splitter for the thin kerf blade needs to be less than the width of the thin kerf blade which is about .091". I don't know but will be asking MJ what the thickness of the splitters are for the thin kerf blade but I suspect they will tell me that it is near .080".

The next issue to find out is if the splitters for the thin kerf blade can be installed in a ZC insert plate that has been set up for the full kerf blade, if they can't, then a person will be forced to buy a separate kit for the thinner blade. I'll make a phone call to MJ and get back to you.

Jerry

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Old 10-04-2013, 10:44 AM   #2 (permalink)
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I must provide a lot of laughs to the members of this forum as I skip along with my learning curve. I called MJ and got the straight scoop on the splitter system and purchased a kit for the thin kerf blade. I am going to attempt to make my own table insert for it, as suggested by Doug several months ago. Doug was good enough to send me the inserts for the leveling screws that I will be needing, thank you again Doug. Anyway I'm learning, but as I said, I must provide some of you at least with an abundance of chuckels. The good part is that I laugh at myself too and that is O.K.

Jerrry
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Old 10-04-2013, 10:59 AM   #3 (permalink)
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<<Written while you where writing post number 2, but we came up with the same conclusion:>>

Info from Micro Jig:

SP-G-P3, Green, Standard width replacement splitters A & B, 8.95.

SP-Y-P3, Yellow, Thinkerf width replacement splitters A & B, 8.95.

Free shipping and handling on both.

Heck, a complete kit each is only $24.95... Combo kit with both sizes is $44.95. Looks like since they have a combo-kit, that they imply it works with either.

If you do the math- You have a left-tilt saw. When you have a .116" blade in and the splitter is .105", you have .005" on each side. You put in a splitter .025" thinner and use a .025" thinner blade... If used in the same insert, it would be better if they molded the pieces offset to the arbor flange side, so that they were directional and sided up to the arbor flange side as constant... but even if they didn't, being they are just plastic and have some flex, they will work.

But since you now found out that your thin kerf blade would work better with a pair of stabilizers and would have to make another insert to use your thin kerf blade with an offset caused by that... Isn't that leaning towards making another zero clearance insert for your thin kerf blade offset (offset right the thickness of one of the two stiffener halves) and then buying a thin kerf MJ Splitter kit for thin kerf blades, to install in that new thin kerf blade zero clearance insert?

Just thinking...
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Last edited by MAFoElffen; 10-04-2013 at 11:12 AM.
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Old 10-04-2013, 11:30 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAFoElffen View Post
<<Written while you where writing post number 2, but we came up with the same conclusion:>>

Info from Micro Jig:

SP-G-P3, Green, Standard width replacement splitters A & B, 8.95.

SP-Y-P3, Yellow, Thinkerf width replacement splitters A & B, 8.95.

Free shipping and handling on both.

Heck, a complete kit each is only $24.95... Combo kit with both sizes is $44.95. Looks like since they have a combo-kit, that they imply it works with either.

If you do the math- You have a left-tilt saw. When you have a .116" blade in and the splitter is .105", you have .005" on each side. You put in a splitter .025" thinner and use a .025" thinner blade... If used in the same insert, it would be better if they molded the pieces offset to the arbor flange side, so that they were directional and sided up to the arbor flange side as constant... but even if they didn't, being they are just plastic and have some flex, they will work.

But since you now found out that your thin kerf blade would work better with a pair of stabilizers and would have to make another insert to use your thin kerf blade with an offset caused by that... Isn't that leaning towards making another zero clearance insert for your thin kerf blade offset (offset right the thickness of one of the two stiffener halves) and then buying a thin kerf MJ Splitter kit for thin kerf blades, to install in that new thin kerf blade zero clearance insert?

Just thinking...
Mike,
The parts are not interchangeable, you need a ZC insert for each set up or an insert that can be reversed end for end and do two set-ups on the same ZC insert. The pins in the bottom of the the splitters are spaced differently, wonder why they did that, Ummmm


My insert fits but the keepers (I'm referring to the pin on one end of the insert and the adjustment screw at the other end) would have to be reversed, no big deal, but I have cut all of those holes in my insert to create better air flow for the DC so, in my case I'll just make the second insert.

I paid $39.95 and freight for the complete orange kit this morning, supposedly on sale.
That's for the Steel Pro Kit.

I'll need to go to Forrest and buy the second stiffener so that I can have one on each side of the blade and of course do that before cutting into the new ZC insert which wil be made of half inch MDF.

Did you speak to the R.O. of the arbor, if you did I must have missed it.

Jerry
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Old 10-04-2013, 12:39 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bowen View Post
<editted>
Did you speak to the R.O. of the arbor, if you did I must have missed it.
Yes I did. But if you measured 0.003" runout at 9" out on your blade <-> you have very little runout at the arbor flange.

Any runout at the arbor flange would increase as it went further out, unless the blade was turned on the arbor to offset that by any blade runout.)

Most people say that 0.005" ro at the arbor is acceptable. I usually try to true the arbor flange to less that 0.001" (0.02mm). Takes lots of time and patience and has to be done on the saw. (I use a jig, router and abrasive bit.)
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Old 10-04-2013, 02:28 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MAFoElffen View Post
Yes I did. But if you measured 0.003" runout at 9" out on your blade <-> you have very little runout at the arbor flange.

Any runout at the arbor flange would increase as it went further out, unless the blade was turned on the arbor to offset that by any blade runout.)

Most people say that 0.005" ro at the arbor is acceptable. I usually try to true the arbor flange to less that 0.001" (0.02mm). Takes lots of time and patience and has to be done on the saw. (I use a jig, router and abrasive bit.)
Mike,

I think that you implied and I think I understand that excessive run out of the arbor would show up in excessive width of the cut and it appears to me that the amount of material that is being removed by the blade is just about exactly the same as the width of the blade.
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Old 10-04-2013, 06:31 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Yes.
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Old 10-05-2013, 11:05 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Jerry Bowen View Post
I must provide a lot of laughs to the members of this forum as I skip along with my learning curve. Anyway I'm learning, but as I said, I must provide some of you at least with an abundance of chuckles. The good part is that I laugh at myself too and that is O.K.

Jerrry
Some may get a laugh out of it but I have learned too that there are always others who have the same question but did not ask. There are some very bright and talented people on this forum but none of them seem to know everything. A few are very close but not yet there. I read every post because some might have answers that I do not yet know enough to ask the question.

My wife often reminds me that knowing too much leaves very little room to learn. Not sure what her message is to me in that, I am afraid to ask.
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Old 10-05-2013, 11:32 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Yes.
Mike,
My remark about the amount of material that is removed by a blade during a cut was not clear. Let me see if I can ask it or express my thinking a little better. What I am wondering is this, if an arbor if has excessive R.O. will the cut made by a blade that is installed on that arbor be wider due the excessive R.O. than it would have been with minimal or no R,O. It's seems to me that the consequences of excessive Rl.O. of the arbor would show up in the wider cut. Are we on the same page on this matter, my opinion is purely coming from my head and not from experience and/or better knowledge sof such matters.

Jerry
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Old 10-05-2013, 12:41 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bowen View Post
Mike,
My remark about the amount of material that is removed by a blade during a cut was not clear. Let me see if I can ask it or express my thinking a little better. What I am wondering is this, if an arbor if has excessive R.O. will the cut made by a blade that is installed on that arbor be wider due the excessive R.O. than it would have been with minimal or no R,O. It's seems to me that the consequences of excessive Rl.O. of the arbor would show up in the wider cut. Are we on the same page on this matter, my opinion is purely coming from my head and not from experience and/or better knowledge sof such matters.

Jerry
Yes. We are on the same page.

If the blade, arbor or both had excessive r.o., either would cause the blade to wobble, causing a wider cut. Example- Cutting like a wobble dado. Being a wider cut than the blade would normally, it would be excessively wider than the plate and splitter, causing the cut to wander, instead of tracking straight...

Another would be if the blade and arbor were not perpendicular to the left miter (out of tune). That would cause a wider cut by cutting one side with the toe of the blade and the other side of the cut by dragging the heel of the blade against the kerf... (although some set some normal minute toe-in preset.)

However the tune is set by "gauges"... The real truth is in the cut and adjusting from there to it cutting straight and true. Yours is in tune (or it seems from your description).

With the too large splitter, it was dragging... and dragging more on one side than the other... but it was not dragging enough to pull the splitter piece out. Dragging on side would tend to cause a slight curve, maybe not notable, but... And cause you to have to push a little harder than normal... which is not a good thing when you consider that those forces are causing you to push (excessively) in a direction into the blade...
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Last edited by MAFoElffen; 10-05-2013 at 12:50 PM.
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