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soft start/variable speed table setup

78K views 200 replies 34 participants last post by  Stick486 
#1 ·
greetings all... here is my situation: I've built a custom router table, invested in top of the line accessories blah, blah, blah.. but as of yet, still have not purchased a router. I would idealy want to have remote control (outside of the router box portion of the cabinet) of router motor speed. Right now, the only production router i can find that allows for this is the Milwaukee 5625 sold as a package with remote varialble speed control. This package has reviewed very well and certainly isn't a bad consideration, however, I'd like to know of any other options. From what I've read, the big PC's and Milwaukee's with soft start and VS will not allow for a 'remote' motor speed controller. I've read through the forum and could not find anything that answered my questions, so i figure go straight to the experts..thanks in advance for any assistance...
 
#2 ·
Welcome to Router Forums, I am not sure of any others that come with a remote speed,
and you taught me that one had it. One of the biggest questions are finding a good plate that will fit a particular router, or which router is the best for table, or hand held routing.
If anyone has an answer for you, they will post. Have If you will give us a little more about yourself, We will be able to communicate and hold common interest with you. Who knows, your friend may be a part of Router Forums ;)
 
#4 ·
ok guys, here is the short story.. quite honestly, the table I've built is way beyond what I need. or probably will ever need for that matter. But dang, its cool. 27 x 49 x 1 3/8" tabletop with an Incra LS fence, wonderfence, Incra rails and mounting base (yes, attached to the router table for quick and easy relocation/removal of the fence) The cabinet itself is 41 x 27. The Cabinet mounts as an addition/extension to my cabinet saw. Will purchase a woodpecker PR2 lift as soon as I decide on the router. I already have a digital height readout mounted on the control side as well as a deadman switch. I've ordered a Jessem Mit-r-slide which I will adapt to my fence assemblies via machined aluminum stock if necessary. not to mention just way to many dooo dads and thingamabobs.. *L*.. You dont' even want the long version, trust me.. anyways, back to the question at hand.. I guess the answer is just cuz, easy access and control of router speed etc.

OH, did i mention, it just looks cool?
 
#6 ·
HI Bill

It sounds like you are going over the deep end just a little bit,,you can pull the control device off the router and mount it in a remote box if you want to..

Or just buy a older router that doesn't come with a VS device built in and just pickup a remote device...(20 amp.type) it will not have the soft start but almost,but you can turn it off or on from the remote box control and control the speed from the remote box..the one that comes to mind is the 3 1/4hp PC.

=========
 
#7 ·
So, i am brand new to the Forum. I, too, want to know what router(s) would be best suited to use in a table. However, I am concerned with a couple of other things: how powerful a tool do I need (is a 2 -2 1/4 HP enough); can I get a tool that can be adjusted from the top surface of the table without using a special surface plate (I am reluctant to have to deal with leveling the plate and assuring that it is flush to the rest of the table top); is variable speed necessary; and, finally, what specific tool(s) do you all recommend? Thanks in advance.
 
#8 ·
With all of those controls ----special fence, special lift-- what do you intend to do? If it is to make lots of joints, then it makes sense. For edge work, some of it might be excessive.
People on forums debate the advantages of a Shaper instead of a router. It sounds like your investment would currently match the cost of a shaper (including the tooling).

For my shop made router table, I bought a 2.15hp Milwaukee. No lift. Height adjustment is above the table. For Dados only, I use a Festool router and their MFT table -- this avoids the hazards of a Dado blade on a tablesaw. For joints, I use a WoodRat mounting a DeWalt 625.

My router investment for the table was $150. Period. Used only for edge work.

gary curtis
 
#9 ·
Soft start offers an advantage primarily to hand-held routers. Not having it means that the machine will jump out of control every time you hit the on/off switch to the ON position. Variable speed keeps the cutting tips from going 'super-sonic'. Thus preventing overheating the carbide tip and burning the wood.

Also allows speed adjustments to match the wood hardness.

gary curtis
 
#10 ·
bobj3, I passed up 'a little over the deep end' on this thing long ago, but all in all, that was kind of the point of the project. waiting for great deals, waiting for sales, nickel and diming it as I went along. The research I've put in, the time, craftsmanship etc. have all contributed to a huge learning curve. Primarily with cabinet design and layout.
 
#11 ·
Sounds like me..

..except I think I've done this backwards. :rolleyes:

I've purchased the PC 7518, have the Incra MAST-R-Lift, Incra LS w/Wonderfence on order, will be ordering a Unisaw in a couple of weeks, hope to design a motorized lift for it and now think of remote speed control. I'm looking for a solution too.

TwoSkies,

What did you use for the table? I want to use the space from the extension table as a router table but would also like to install a Veritas twin-screw end vise (own it) on the end.

The router table would be best in MDF but I'd like to have the end vise attached to laminated maple. I'm trying to decide between going one way or the other or making the end near the saw of MDF and the end from Maple. I'm wondering about the differing expansion factors due to humidity.

I look forward to learning more of your decisions and following how they work for you.

Jim in Alaska
 
#12 ·
Jim,
If I understand your concerns about the expansion table top correctly, I think there is a solution. This would work if you have some good quartersawn or stabile hardwood (maple, maybe?).
Make a frame of hardwood. The frame would have the end laminated to accept the Veritas vise. The inside of the frame would have a step cut into it to accomodate the MDF or your choice. I would make a substantial step, perhaps 1/2". You could also attach cleats to the inside of the frame. The frame should be cross braced beneath, at intervals, to help support the router placement and to insure against movement. You can glue the MDF into the frame, fasten, or let it float. I would do the first two. Irregardless, this method allows for any movement of the MDF and allows for the vise mounting.
 
#13 ·
this what you mean?

westend,

I have attached a sketch of what I think you said. Do I understand you correctly? I really like the idea of a hybrid. How do I account for the difference in expansion between the maple and the MDF if I affix the two together? I am envisioning two-sided laminate covered MDF to protect from moisture warping the MDF.

Perhaps a couple of screws near the router lift with slotted screw holes near the outside?

This would also have the advantage of making the router table "replaceable" without having to buy another 20+ board feet of hard maple ($6.20/bd ft here in Anchorage). ..or if I were to make my first ever mistake when routing the router lift cutout. <g>

Jim
 

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#15 ·
westend,

I have attached a sketch of what I think you said. Do I understand you correctly? I really like the idea of a hybrid. How do I account for the difference in expansion between the maple and the MDF if I affix the two together? I am envisioning two-sided laminate covered MDF to protect from moisture warping the MDF.

Perhaps a couple of screws near the router lift with slotted screw holes near the outside?

This would also have the advantage of making the router table "replaceable" without having to buy another 20+ board feet of hard maple ($6.20/bd ft here in Anchorage). ..or if I were to make my first ever mistake when routing the router lift cutout. <g>

Jim
Jim,
Not quite what I had in mind but almost. The frame that holds the MDF should completely edge-band the piece of MDF. I'm guessing that this is called a stepped dado (see attachment). If you made this frame to join to the other pieces of maple, you're only joining maple to maple and along the same grain. Expansion would be the same for the maple pieces and the end of the frame.
I used this kind of frame for a table saw extension. It worked out great.

I need to get along more on my learning curve with Sketchup so I can share designs and access the libraries and such.
 

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#16 ·
Lance,

Treating the laminate router table top MDF) as if it were a giant router lift (i.e. with it resting in a dado cutout in the maple? Hmmm.... That has promise too! :yes4:

Jim
 
#17 ·
BigJim..

I broke down and purchased a custom sized table from Woodpeckers (28" x 49" x 1 3/8"). this included them placing the plate hole exactly where I needed it. The table itself is laminated MDF with a industrial grade phenolic laminate on both the top and bottom. Money I believe well spent. I don't believe expansion for you would be much of an issue. Mounting a twin screw to it might be though. Mounting wouldn't be a problem, but the constant stress applied to the screw might be unless you really do a good job of reinforcing the table and make good use of legs to the floor. My table is mounted to a cabinet I built. The LS runs on a pair of Incra TS rails and basemount. This way I can pop the entire assembly off in a heart beat...AS for remote control. I'm sold on it, I want it *L* and damned if i can find the milwaukee (jessem) 05626 motor. I have a call into Jessen and they are trying to run one down for me. Every where I've called, they are out of stock and not going to get anymore. Jessem says the have stopped production. My guess is due to the high cost. I've spoken to two electrical motor shops and they both agree that because of the ue of a circuit board, built into the big routers, converting them is not a very good idea..but I'll keep looking...
 
#18 ·
Bill,

I started out planning on purchasing a laminate TS extension router table and a laminated maple workbench with a twinscrew based upon Popular Mechanic's PM November 2004 Woodworking Guide: Build A Workbench - Popular Mechanics

Following their plans should make it suitably strong, I figured.

As I started pricing things, I realized that even with "free shipping" as offered by many (for the lower 48), it would still cost me about $200 in freight to get it trucked to Alaska. That idea galled the sh*t out of me, so back to the drawing board. Shortly thereafter I started hearing the new Unisaw has a table that's more like 30" wide, so I'd have to order one custom. Too many board feet of hardwood could be purchased for that $200 freight.

Now I'm awaiting a check (Friday??) to order a new Unisaw and then I'll decide for sure. My inclination is to build one out of cheap wood and see how I like it. I want to see just how inconvenient the low height, distance to the router is, and if the Biesemeyer works well with a combined unit. This will be a prototype. I'll either replace the factory table and go with a dedicated router table or decide to go with the maple. Either way it'll be a learning experience, both from whether or not I like the design as well as experience with that large of a glue-up and end vise mounting experience.

Either way, the prototype can be shortened and used as a "beat-on" work surface for when you need to work work on something metal.

I am really appreciating the feedback, ideas and suggestions I'm getting here. This is a good group!

Jim
 
#19 ·
Jim...
I never even thought of the shipping to AK... thats gotta be a deal killer for sure..

well, here is something more to ponder on....as if there isn't enough already. Consider a freestanding table. Giving you the flexibility to move the table around if and when you need to. Design your table a lil short of the height of your new saw and use it for an outfeed table. Killing two birds with one stone. A little planning ahead will allow for the quick removal of the LS positioner. Place a piece of 3/4" mdf or other suitable material over the top of the router table (just to save the table top from getting all scratched up). Give yourself some extra wide mitre slots so exact alignment isn't necessary.
the only question would be where the dust port for the TS is located and how to work around it....
 
#21 ·
ok guys, a good friend passed this link onto me. One of the best if not the best piece i've seen on converting a 5625 Milwaukee to what amount to a 05626 Milwaukee (with factory remote VS control) I have concerns about how this might effec the routers PCB control. However, if you read the article. the author claims there are no issues?...I'm guessing this conversion would apply to just about any router.. Before you try it, consult with someone who would know one way or the other first...

WoodNet Forums: Milwaukee 5625 Router convert JessEm 5626 - WARNING - PIC HEAVY
 
#22 ·
For those of you out there that are following this lil adventure or just curious here's the latest. It seems that Jessem and Milwaukee have parted ways. the 05626 with remote variable speed is no longer available and out of production. (per jessem) I'm running out of patience but have yet to hear back from Jessem on a possibly inventory return they were expecting to recieve. Once again, the folks at Jessem have been great to deal with. I've been very impressed with their customer service. Most of of the websites that offer the unit just havn't taken the add offline yet. I've heard the rumor that Jessem is looking at providing another remote VS router via another mfg. heard that from two different vendors, but nothing to support it.
 
#23 · (Edited)
hi Bill,

after reading the forum for quite a little while, i know we have some milwaukee users but it seems the majority are dewalt, craftsman , bosch and makita. so it may not get a lot of questions. im not sure?????? maybe my take is wrong? anyway, i know i wouldnt be interested in a milwaukee router. dont get me wrong their sawzall is great. and their drills are too. i just havent heard a lot of people that have been on the forum for awhile talking about the milwaukee routers.maybe my post will get them started!

i think Nick on the forum you moderate may have a milwaukee? not sure?
 
#25 ·
Hey Levon..

Yes, surprisingly (at least to me) not much mention in here about the Milwaukee line of routers. I don't put much stock in any mfg's review of their own product. I do rely heavily on 2nd party reviews and consumer comments which weigh heavily in my decession making process. I think it part its due to the fact that most of the guys who have been using routers for quite a while have gone to PC and stuck with them. and why not, if something works and works well, why change. The killer with the 05626 in my opinion has got to be the price point. At 500 a pop, just how much market share did they think they were going to get? Considering that the base model 0525 is around 275 +/- a few bucks.
Its priced competitively. Take away the router base, add a remote VSC (which in the end couldn't have added much if anything to the cost) and you've got something to should sell just above the PC 75182. But nooooooooooooooooooooooooo.... *L*
 
#26 ·
hiya BigJim,

yeppers, PC has a lot of em no doubt. In fact, I am leaning towards an 890 if I can't find a Milwaukee anytime soon. The 890 has been a solid performer even with its history of problems. From what i've read, PC is quick and more than willing to resolve any issues you may run across. I do believe that the newer models are more reliable, thinking that PC has corrected any problems with the line.
One thing i've heard and have been trying to confrim is that the (just an example) 890 you might pick up at a local retailer is NOT identical to an 890 you may pick up at say Rockler or woodcraft. In order to put the product on the shelf, the mfg. is given a price point by the seller and the unit is then modeled to meet that price point. Often sacraficing high end quality parts in order to meet the sellers pricepoint..

btw, how goes your own project? where do you stand with it? I've been following your posts and havn't heard much of late?...

how's the 'skeeters' up there this time of year???
 
#29 ·
hiya BigJim,

yeppers, PC has a lot of em no doubt. In fact, I am leaning towards an 890 if I can't find a Milwaukee anytime soon. The 890 has been a solid performer even with its history of problems. From what i've read, PC is quick and more than willing to resolve any issues you may run across. I do believe that the newer models are more reliable, thinking that PC has corrected any problems with the line.
One thing i've heard and have been trying to confrim is that the (just an example) 890 you might pick up at a local retailer is NOT identical to an 890 you may pick up at say Rockler or woodcraft. In order to put the product on the shelf, the mfg. is given a price point by the seller and the unit is then modeled to meet that price point. Often sacraficing high end quality parts in order to meet the sellers pricepoint..

btw, how goes your own project? where do you stand with it? I've been following your posts and havn't heard much of late?...

how's the 'skeeters' up there this time of year???

Bill,

My project goes.. but not nearly as fast as I want it to! I've received the PC 7518, an Incra LS 25 Supersystem, Incra Mast-r-lift, Wixey remote digital readout and an Incra miter gauge. I've got a MasterGage and Lee Valley 50" aluminum straightedge in the mail.

I've got the cash for the Unisaw but am holding off ordering it until I finalize the power run into my garage. My desire is to install a 100A fused disconnect off of the mains (just downstream of the main breaker) and have a plug/receptacle that connects a 3/c #2 cable to a subpanel in the garage. I want to use an "extension cord" approach since I'm leasing and want to take it with me when I go.

The holdup so far is looking for a less-expensive plug/receptacle pair. Finding a 100A setup that's NEC 3R (rainproof) rated has so far left me with $1,000 just for the two. That's just too d*mned much to spend on a plug.

So, I'm working with some of the local electrical suppliers to see if one of them will cut me a deal. I'm not looking for free but am hoping one of them will consider something near cost, since its for hobby use and I specify hundreds of thousands in electrical components per year for industrial applications. The people I've needed to talk to have been on vacation the last couple of weeks; starting next week it's time to go hardcore!

If that is unsuccessful, I'll drop back to 60A service. With that, I have to decide if I want to have the 40A slow-blow circuit Delta recommends for their 5hp Unisaw or if I should go with the 3hp. The $200 extra for the motor I can see, but not $1,000 for the outside outlet! :shout:

I'm getting mighty antsy though.. I've given the cast iron tables on my dripp press, jointer, planer, bandsaw and scrollsaw a going over with Phosphoric acid / Boeshield and gave them a preliminary tuning. That's what led to ordering the straightedge and mastergage!

As for the skeeters.. its been a sunny spring so they aren't too thick.. barely enough for a swarm to carry away a small dog. A couple of weeks of rain though, and then the moose better watch out!

Jim
 
#27 ·
yep, you guys are right, there are a lot of pc's here. i have a vegetable soup in my small router collection. i have an old cheap b&d that has a 1/4 collet but works. i have a pc 7529 and a 3 base pro combo craftsman and my last was a bosch 1617 with 2 bases.
im no expert on any of them. the bosch is a great router. the craftsman is a joy to work with, the worklights and the ease of adjustment is wonderful.

i think we all just seem to prefer certain brands for some reason and most seem to work very well. its sort of like fishing, if you have confidence in a lure, you will catch fish on it, but no matter how good another lure is, if we dont have confidence in it, by nature we wont use it enough to catch fish on it. dumb but true:)
 
#28 ·
Levon.. your right,,, dead on..

I think it has more to do with two things. First is "does it work".. and if it does, why mess with it. and Second is "feel". We learn how to use a specific router. We learn how it feels, how it reacts, we come to anticipate what the router will do. The operation of a good tool becomes instinctive. We push a lil here, lean this way or that, tilt the head to the left or right, set the speed just right. We get used to the weight, the noise and the kick. Its all good, when it works well and we've spent some time getting used to the tool. Everytime we get a new one, the process starts all over again.
 
#30 ·
hey Jim...

I see your point about the whole electrical thing. Hate to put money into something that isn't going to be permanent. Since I don't know the EC codes up there. have you considered a electrical generator as a source of power? Minor mods to tie into your shop while you are there, and when your ready to relocate, it relocates with ya and you can keep it as a backup or just sale it outright to recoup some of the expense?..
 
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