Finishing is finishing me off - Page 2 - Router Forums
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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 11:02 AM
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I think Herb's advice is solid. The walnut looks beautiful and any finish used shouldn't cover that up but rather enhance it. I'd go with Herb's advice and see how that looks but I suspect highly it will be as wonderful as you expect it to be.
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 01:11 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you all for your suggestions:

Theo, actually the table will be view daily under sort off a “raking” light. The table will be situated between a sectional and a 3 pane sliding glass door. When the sun is up, and it usually is in Florida, it will show the blotches if you’re sitting on the sectional looking across the table. That’s why I have the concern about the blotches. In my old home in PA, before I moved to FL, I wouldn’t care because, in that case, you’d be right. I do have some projects that I’ve completed with a “good enough for government work” mind set. This can’t be one of them

Herb, I bought a micromesh kit that contained small squares of all the grits. I used it on a name plaque that I had to repair after one of my grandsons broke his. After gluing I had to sand the whole front surface and I refinished it with the Zar 50/50 since I had it around. After it cured I micromeshed, if there is such a word, up to 6000 and it was so shiny that it looked like it was coated in plastic. Because the table will be used every day we decided on a semi-gloss finish. We think that gloss will show every tiny scratch. The semi might too, we’ll see. I do have some project in mind where I might go for the “grand piano” finish. First, I have to finish this %$#@#(* table top.

I never heard of the Lundmark wax. I have regular Johnson’s that I use on my cast iron surfaces, Briwax which I never really loved and don’t use it much and Renaissance wax which I have used on small projects with good success. I do like that the Lundmark contains carnauba wax. I add carnauba into my home made cutting board wax to add hardness. So, for a coffee table, that will get daily use, what wax would you recommend?

If I have to, I can bring the table into the house to finish it but I’m concerned about the solvent smell.

Dan, I’m taking your advice and will contact customer service at UGL, the manufacturer of ZAR and see what they suggest in terms of the mix, the temperature and humidity and the way I’m applying it. I will post any response I get since it might be useful to other forum members who live in hot and humid conditions.

Steve, thanks for your vote of confidence. I’ll try to live up to it.

If you have an open mind, you’ll generally find that you’ll learn the most from the people who say the things you least want to hear.
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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sreilly View Post
Is it the heat or humidity that is the problem? I would be very suspect of high humidity slowing the curing process down substantially. The A/C lowers the temperature by removing the humidity. Of course A/C works a bit easier in places like Arizona.
Its actually the opposite, once the temps climb the wipe on poly dries as I'm applying it. it becomes lumpy and can not be smoothed or flattened in any way. Under 70f, it goes on smooth and finishes like glass.
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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 05:12 PM
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Barry, Johnsons Wax is fine, I like the Lundmark for the carnuba. Can't help you on the satin finish, I just sand the final coat with with 400g. and wax, the wax takes out any sanding marks.
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 08:05 PM
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It's hard to tell from the photos, but what I saw in the raking light photo appears to be a haziness. If it's haziness, it's called blushing. It occurs in high humidity conditions. Moisture gets trapped in the finish, and the finish dries too much before it is released. Manufacturers of fine finishes (think auto paint), they make retarders, which are added to the paint to slow down drying time. I use a lot of clear CAB lacquer (I spray my finishes), but rarely have to use retarders because my shop is temperature controlled and humidity stay at a reasonable level.

I don't use brushes much, except for interior and exterior house painting, but you should be able to get a decent finish with a high quality brush. Thinning for a wipe on may be making blushing worse. A thinner coat drys faster than a thicker one. A very thin wipe on coat, coupled with high temperatures, may be causing the finish to dry too quickly and be unable to release the moisture. I suggest trying unthinned finish applied in full (but not heavy) coats applied with a brush.

By the way, you generally have to sand blush out. You should do your painting in a temperature controlled setting, like inside an air conditioned house. If you are intent on applying the finish at ambient temperature and humidity, the odds are high you are going to continue experiencing the same problem.

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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 08:23 PM
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It looks to me like you sanded through one or more layers of finish.
Since polyurethane does not "melt" previous coats, each layer is unique, and if you sand through it, you'll see it's edges.

If that's the case, then the only real fix is stripping it.

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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-10-2019, 07:13 AM
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Is it possible that the ROS sanding is heating up the finish causing it to blush...?

I would try hand sanding instead with a good flat block sander.

For applying the finish and to avoid bubbles, try wiping off the excess as soon as it is applied and between applications...? This might allow for less sanding between coats...?

Also try applying with something that might have less texture than a paper towel (depending on what you're using now). The texture might be creating the bubbles.
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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-10-2019, 12:12 PM
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I only ever use decent quality foam brushes and never go back over poly once I've completed a brush stroke (once in one direction, then a return stroke, and slightly overlap on the next brush stroke...then leave it alone!
Further to my comment earlier, maybe i will give Floetrol another try with polyurethane. Never really thought of it before this subject came up.
The downside to longer open time is that there's more opportunity for dust to get into the finish.
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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-10-2019, 12:15 PM
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I've seen hand sanding heat up a finish too. It'll start sticking to the paper. A hair dryer or heat gun will pop bubbles in a finish. Otis has said that he uses a propane torch for that. In any of those cases you might want to try a test piece first.

Someone I consider a master woodworker once told me that a master woodworker is not someone who never makes mistakes. He is someone who is able to cover them up so that no one can tell.
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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-10-2019, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaninVan View Post
I only ever use decent quality foam brushes and never go back over poly once I've completed a brush stroke (once in one direction, then a return stroke, and slightly overlap on the next brush stroke...then leave it alone!
Further to my comment earlier, maybe i will give Floetrol another try with polyurethane. Never really thought of it before this subject came up.
The downside to longer open time is that there's more opportunity for dust to get into the finish.
I've had problems with fast dry finishes even when spraying them. Some dry so fast when atomized that the surface feels pebbly to the touch. Lacquer works okay because the solvent melts into the previous coat but it doesn't work as well on water based finishes. I'll have to have a look at the Floetrol as a solution. As far as dust, it only takes maybe 1/2 an hour to build a frames and cover it with poly so that you can put the piece in it to cure. Build 3 sides with one side left open and you have a makeshift spray booth that keeps most of the finish off other things in your shop.
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Someone I consider a master woodworker once told me that a master woodworker is not someone who never makes mistakes. He is someone who is able to cover them up so that no one can tell.
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