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Bosch Router Switch Problem

17K views 41 replies 13 participants last post by  harlan dyer 
#1 ·
I have been having switch failure problems with my 1617. One of the switches which was replaced under warranty failed within weeks of the replacement after very few uses. The new switch, as supplied by Bosch Customer Service, has begun exhibiting similar problems.

This router is infrequently used. Having the switch fail after just a few uses is a major concern.

I noticed other conversations about cleaning the switch so decided to give it a try. There was not any dust or chips within the switch housing. The contacts were severely burned and pitted. To my eye the size of the contact point appears to be extremely undersized for this application.

Those of you with more experience may be able to take a look at the photos and suggest an improvement or work around. It doesn't appear that replacing the switch with another Bosch part will be the fix.

Regards,

Bill
 

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#2 ·
Sorry Bill, I am far from an expert, but i would think that a switch should last many years, givin the fact that the knowledge has been around for about 80 + years. I can not judge by the picture, but if it was replaced within a year, or so, and it is shot again, tells me that the company needs to do more about the problem. I would contact them,and demand that the problem, as repaired by them is not a solution. I believe that you should get many years of good service, from a company such as theirs. I would make contact with the co. and tell them what is going on, and see if they have a better solution to the problem now.
 
#3 ·
Bill, I do not know why you keep having problems with the switches. Lets see if we can figure it out. Do you plug into a wall outlet or an extension cord? If a cord what size wire and how long? Are you using an external speed controler or switch? Your model is a 1617, not a 1617EVS correct?
 
#4 ·
Bill, I do not know why you keep having problems with the switches. Lets see if we can figure it out. Do you plug into a wall outlet or an extension cord? If a cord what size wire and how long? Are you using an external speed controler or switch? Your model is a 1617, not a 1617EVS correct?
Hi Bill:

Mike's posting raises a couple of very good points.

1. If one is using an undersized extension cord, then the voltage to the motor will be lower and, thus, the motor will draw more current. The 1617 has a rating of 11A, which is borderline on the switch's capacity (80% of stated 15A = 12A.)

2. If the motor unit is the 1617 (no soft-start and no variable speed), then the motor is a highly inductive load for the switch. Switching the motor can generate distructive voltage spikes across the motor. These spikes would be impressed on the switch, possibly causing an arc when the switch opens. The solution for this situation is to add an RC snubber circuit across the motor. One possible circuit is a circuit of a 4.7uF non-polarized capacitor in series with a 100 Ohm, 1 Watt resistor. This series circuit is then wired parallel to the motor. (It's been a long time since I designed a snubber circuit. Hopefully it works.)

Cassandra
 
#5 ·
Extending Life of Switch

My Bosch is of fairly recent purchase, but, after learning of the switch problem, I protect the switch by leaving it on all the time and controlling power with a foot switch. I like both hands on the work, anyway. I use foot switches on both my router table and drill press for safety as well as saving the built-in switches.

The switch is sourced from a standard Taiwan supplier of Chinese switches (Solteam MR25 series), so it might not be too difficult to substitute a more reliable one.

I wonder if setting the speed on a slow speed before startup would help. Most motors have a huge inrush of current until they get up to speed, so startup is when switches have to carry the most current.

I also have an essential medical device that has an unreliable power switch that is very expensive to replace, so I use an inline cord switch for it. That is something to consider, as well, although I haven't used any inline switches for high loads. The little thumbwheel ones are certainly not up to the task, but some of the rocker switch ones might be. There is a lot of flexibility/cheating on switch ratings. Here is one that is rated at 15 amps:

Brn In Line Cord Switch 939BPCC5 by Pass and Seymour | DoItYourself.com
 
#9 ·
My Bosch is of fairly recent purchase, but, after learning of the switch problem, I protect the switch by leaving it on all the time and controlling power with a foot switch. I like both hands on the work, anyway. I use foot switches on both my router table and drill press for safety as well as saving the built-in switches.

The switch is sourced from a standard Taiwan supplier of Chinese switches (Solteam MR25 series), so it might not be too difficult to substitute a more reliable one.

I wonder if setting the speed on a slow speed before startup would help. Most motors have a huge inrush of current until they get up to speed, so startup is when switches have to carry the most current.

I also have an essential medical device that has an unreliable power switch that is very expensive to replace, so I use an inline cord switch for it. That is something to consider, as well, although I haven't used any inline switches for high loads. The little thumbwheel ones are certainly not up to the task, but some of the rocker switch ones might be. There is a lot of flexibility/cheating on switch ratings. Here is one that is rated at 15 amps:

Brn In Line Cord Switch 939BPCC5 by Pass and Seymour | DoItYourself.com

Thanks for the suggestions. There is an electronics supply not very far from me. I might have to wander over that way and see what they have on hand.

If I had the router table mounted all of the time I could just mount an external switch. I need to use the router as a hand held from time to time and need the switch on the tool. Finding a properly rated switch is the answer.

Regards,

Bill
 
#12 ·
Another Bosch 1617EVS switch failure

Like the original post, I too have a 1617EVS that I purchased 1Q2008, very little use. The switch on this one just went out as well. Apparently the newer models don't have this problem fixed either.

I could pop the switch out, but the leads are very short, what is the method of opening the router, remove those 2 star screws that are in deep wells seen from the top ?

Will Bosch send a replacement switch or do you have to send it in to them ?
 
#13 ·
Like the original post, I too have a 1617EVS that I purchased 1Q2008, very little use. The switch on this one just went out as well. Apparently the newer models don't have this problem fixed either.

I could pop the switch out, but the leads are very short, what is the method of opening the router, remove those 2 star screws that are in deep wells seen from the top ?

Will Bosch send a replacement switch or do you have to send it in to them ?
Hi Doug:

Just pop out those two star drive screws (Torx) and the plastic cover comes off. The electronics module is then loose, other than the wires tieing it the rest of the unit.

This technique is also used to access the brushes -- no more screws to remove to get at the brushes.

To get at the commutator on the rotor, then one needs to remove two more screws -- Phillips if I remember correctly. Then the next block of plastic can be removed.

Cassandra
 
#16 ·
Both of my model 1617 routers have been trouble free for 9 years. The problem seems to be only on the 1617EVS models. I am wondering if the speed controller module is causing added strain on the switch? I have been using a 1613EVS for all my free hand work for the last couple months and so far no problems with it. It will be interesting to see how well it holds up.
 
#17 ·
Both of my model 1617 routers have been trouble free for 9 years. The problem seems to be only on the 1617EVS models. I am wondering if the speed controller module is causing added strain on the switch? I have been using a 1613EVS for all my free hand work for the last couple months and so far no problems with it. It will be interesting to see how well it holds up.
Hi Mike:

I have had the 1617EVS for a couple of years now, without any problems with the switch. As for the EVS module causing problems with the switch, I suspect that the effects of the module would reduce the demand on the switch, especially during starting. To achieve the soft-start feature, the module would reduce the starting current, gradually increasing the current until the running current is achieved.

When I had my 1617EVS apart for cleaning, I did not see any capacitor of significant size. Thus, the switch would not be subjected to in-rush current on the capacitor.

Cassandra
 
#18 ·
Your point is well taken Cassandra, but I was thinking of a mechanical strain because of the short wires mentioned by someone. With all the plastic parts I was thinking perhaps there was enough flexing to cause wear. It does not take much. At any rate we know that when trouble shooting an electromechanical system the most likely cause of failure will be a solid state device, and that is the reason I opted for a straight switch. The much larger external speed controller will dissipate heat faster, being attached to the table it gets less vibration, and is a whole lot easier to replace if it fails.
 
#19 · (Edited)
Good point, Mike, on the possible flexing of short leads. However, given that the switch and EVS module are both held well when the router is assembled, flexing shouldn't be a problem. Your other points are well founded.

Your comment on the vibration raises a good question: what are the effects of the vibration from the router motor on the router switch? Quite possibly, the motor vibration is causing some contact movement within the switch.

Cassandra
 
#20 ·
This is the best of what the forums has to offer. Cassandra has the engineering/design experience and I have the trouble shooting/repair experience so we can attack the problem from both ends. I know there are many forum members who could contribute to these discusions and just don't bother. All of us working together makes this the best place on the web so please do join in and post your thoughts.
 
#21 ·
This is the best of what the forums has to offer. Cassandra has the engineering/design experience and I have the trouble shooting/repair experience so we can attack the problem from both ends. I know there are many forum members who could contribute to these discusions and just don't bother. All of us working together makes this the best place on the web so please do join in and post your thoughts.
Well said, Mike!

In engineering, we engineers rely on technologists and technicians to make our designs workable.

Cassandra
 
#23 ·
Years ago I would of laughed and agreed with you Jim. In fact one place I worked had a sign that said: "Lets play engineer. You design something wrong and I will make it work." This is a very one sided view. The engineer depends on a machine builder, an electrician and a pipe fitter to bring their vision to life. Everyone is expected to be on the same sheet of music, but everyone tends to look at things through their own eyes. Here is a perfect example I had to deal with. An engineer designed a press/spot welding machine. All the numbers checked out. An outside vendor welded up the frame. The machine builder had to mount a 12" diameter cylinder in the frame with clearance for the hose on the rear side. The electricians installed all the wiring and controls. Now it is my turn to fit the hoses, pipes and valves to complete the project. I install the JIC fitting into the cylinder with no problem. Then I take the hose and slide it into position. Oops. No room to fit a wrench on the hose end to tighten it. Lots of finger pointing and name calling goes on here, the cylinder is unpinned and lifted with a crane so the hose can be tightened properly and reinstalled. Oh, did I mention there were 5 of these machines? There were two elegant and simple solutions to this problem. The cylinder could be mounted 2" further forward and it would of worked; or they could of cut an access hole in the frame to use a wrench from the back side.(The far better choice from my view) I asked if I could relay this information to the engineer and was told to mind my own business. Engineers rarely work on the machines, and almost never assist in building them. It is not reasonable to expect them to know all the details of the assembly process. The machine builders never work on the machines so they do not care how difficult a repair job is. A little common sense goes a long way, and I am careful about who I point my finger at these days.
 
#24 ·
Years ago I would of laughed and agreed with you Jim. In fact one place I worked had a sign that said: "Lets play engineer. You design something wrong and I will make it work." This is a very one sided view. The engineer depends on a machine builder, an electrician and a pipe fitter to bring their vision to life. Everyone is expected to be on the same sheet of music, but everyone tends to look at things through their own eyes. Here is a perfect example I had to deal with. An engineer designed a press/spot welding machine. All the numbers checked out. An outside vendor welded up the frame. The machine builder had to mount a 12" diameter cylinder in the frame with clearance for the hose on the rear side. The electricians installed all the wiring and controls. Now it is my turn to fit the hoses, pipes and valves to complete the project. I install the JIC fitting into the cylinder with no problem. Then I take the hose and slide it into position. Oops. No room to fit a wrench on the hose end to tighten it. Lots of finger pointing and name calling goes on here, the cylinder is unpinned and lifted with a crane so the hose can be tightened properly and reinstalled. Oh, did I mention there were 5 of these machines? There were two elegant and simple solutions to this problem. The cylinder could be mounted 2" further forward and it would of worked; or they could of cut an access hole in the frame to use a wrench from the back side.(The far better choice from my view) I asked if I could relay this information to the engineer and was told to mind my own business. Engineers rarely work on the machines, and almost never assist in building them. It is not reasonable to expect them to know all the details of the assembly process. The machine builders never work on the machines so they do not care how difficult a repair job is. A little common sense goes a long way, and I am careful about who I point my finger at these days.
I only say that because I *am* an engineer, Mike! You're right though, feedback is unfortunately nonexistent.. What I've found though is that a visit to the guys who will install, maintain and operate whatever I'm designing ahead of time (while I'm in sketch mode) goes a long way. Besides, with their feeback incorporated all they can say is "Danged good design", the install goes smoothly (or they hide any oopses) and the client is happy. They also know if something doesn't go right, they can call me directly and we'll solve it, rather than going through the "chain of command" (client). Reaching out to start that idea-sharing early has paid biiiiiig dividends for me!! Your mileage may vary... :)
 
#25 ·
Hi Jim and Mike:

We're in agreement then that team work is needed by all who work on a project.

When I was doing my engineering apprenticeship (and since) one of my philosophies was to solicit inputs from various people on each project. That included the owners, the builders, the servicers, and most importantly the users. Lots of useful information came forth -- information that allowed me to design better. Heck, I even taught my mentor quite a few things, when he would listen.

There is also the lesson from the Dale Carnegie course: Together Everyone Achieves More.

Cassandra
 
#26 ·
As a millwright if I chime in now there will be a third point of view. :) The design might have looked good and the assembly may have worked fine but when it comes time to repair it NO ONE seems to have thought about that! Impossible spots to get into. Parts that won't come out without a complete tear down. The list goes on. I can tell you that for most of the machinery in my plant no one ever asked a for a millwright's input in either the design or building stages. We have in house engineers but most of the machine fabrication is done outside the plant. We rarely see the blueprints until the installation phase. After that it's all on our shoulders to deal with the issues. That blue haze you see in factories is usually coming off of some millwright's tongue..LOL.
 
#27 ·
when it comes time to repair it NO ONE seems to have thought about that! Impossible spots to get into. Parts that won't come out without a complete tear down. The list goes on.
A prime example is the automotive industry. Have you tried to do repair on late model cars?

I had a Ford AeroStar and, since warranty ended in 1997, I was doing my own repairs. I have cursed the automotive engineers for their extreme short-sightedness when it comes to serviceability.

Cassandra
 
#28 ·
Repaired switch

Thanks Cassandra for the detailed info on the switch removal and repair.
I called Bosch, they sent out a new switch, which I received the next day.
It looks like the same switch. I bought my 1617evs early in 2008, the original switch looks like it has a date stamped on it of 06/23/06. The replacement reads 02/23/09.
You indicated you repaired your switch by cleaning it out, it seems the new ones now have a double problem, dust still fills the switch, and the contacts burn. I'd say we've gone from bad to worse. Simply cleaning the dust out isn't going to fix it, maybe a light sanding would get it to work, but that won't last long.
I wonder if the sawdust is contributing to the contact burning problem ?
Perhaps by building up on the contacts they don't close completely causing an arc. I also suspect the contact material isn't as good as it was before, assuming contact burning wasn't an issue before. By the way, I'm just a hobbyist, don't use the router much at all, so I'm real surprised at how short lived the switch was.
 

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#29 ·
Hi Doug

A little bit of silicon around the switch will help,,when the dust gets it the switch it will cook the dust on the points,a little fire so to speak..:)
Take a flat tooth pick and push it in the holes..but don't fill the switch up just the holes.

==========

Thanks Cassandra for the detailed info on the switch removal and repair.
I called Bosch, they sent out a new switch, which I received the next day.
It looks like the same switch. I bought my 1617evs early in 2008, the original switch looks like it has a date stamped on it of 06/23/06. The replacement reads 02/23/09.
You indicated you repaired your switch by cleaning it out, it seems the new ones now have a double problem, dust still fills the switch, and the contacts burn. I'd say we've gone from bad to worse. Simply cleaning the dust out isn't going to fix it, maybe a light sanding would get it to work, but that won't last long.
I wonder if the sawdust is contributing to the contact burning problem ?
Perhaps by building up on the contacts they don't close completely causing an arc. I also suspect the contact material isn't as good as it was before, assuming contact burning wasn't an issue before. By the way, I'm just a hobbyist, don't use the router much at all, so I'm real surprised at how short lived the switch was.
 
#30 ·
Hi Doug and Mr. Jigs:

Silicone will do the job but, whatever you do, don't get it on the contacts! We in the electrical engineering business know that silicone on contacts is a nightmare.

Anything that is compatible with the plastic and that seals against the dust would do. A little bit of grease (e.g. silicone grease) can work.

Cassandra
 
#31 ·
Looks like I'm about a year late to this thread, but here are my two cents on this along with some recent experience.

My 1617 evs has serial number 8713124. The tech support people told me it was made in 2008 and could not possibly have the infamous switch problem. I took it apart. It does.

If you are having a similar problem, mine only required the removal of two phillips head screws. That removed the outer plastic housing. The switch just pops out. The switch itself is pretty simple. You can separate the two plastic pieceswith some care and patience. Inside you will probably find a ton (that could be an slight exaggeration) of sawdust as well as a small, loose metal piece. You don't want to lose that. The small metal piece is what connects the power when the switch makes.

I was very careful when taking the switch apart. My theory is that the switch fails for two reasons, 1) sawdust, and/or 2) that metal piece slips out of position. My small metal piece appeared to have slide off to the side. Since there is not much there holding it in place, if your router falls over, or otherwise experiences a little shock, the metal piece could slide out of position. That's my theory and I'm sticking to it. ;-)

Bosch support is another issue that I will not bore you with here, but let me summaries and say they were zero help.

Hope this helps someone else.

Harlan Dyer
 
#32 ·
Just to be fair, I got a email from Bosch today saying they made a mistake. My router was made in 1998 not 2008 so they are sending me a new switch. Of course, based on comments that I have seen here and other places, the new switch is not much better than the old one. We will see.

Maybe I'll make it to 10 posts after all. ;-)

HD
 
#33 ·
Harlan, Bosch is very good about handling out of warranty repairs or supplying replacement parts. Please let us know how things turn out. If you have any problems please PM me.
 
#35 · (Edited)
#36 ·
I recently bought a reconditioned 1617EVS from CPOBosch and figured that this switch issue was in the distant past. Was I mistaken! After two hours of routing mortises the router wouldn't turn on. I pulled the switch apart and lo and behold it was jammed full of sawdust. After cleaning it failed again after another hour or so. The switch had no seals whatsoever inside it. I'm very surprised that they are selling very old reconditioned routers without replacing these defective switches.

I did not have as good a luck talking to Bosch as the folks here. My router is still in warranty so I asked them to send me a new switch. They told me that on warranty repairs like this the only resolution would be for me to send them the router (with me paying the freight cost). Since buying a new switch was cheaper than shipping the router I opted for buying a new switch, though it definitely annoys the heck out of me that I'm paying my own money to fix an in-warranty defective tool.

This isn't the only problem with this router. The 1/2" collet supplied with the router was too small a diameter. None of my 1/2" bits would slide into the collet. I have the sneaking suspicion that perhaps it was supplied with a metric size collet. At least with this one they agreed to send me a collet for free.

Anyway, I'm not happy with Bosch. Two failures on a reconditioned part is pretty bad, and their refusal to send me a switch makes it doubly annoying. I've had good luck with CPOBosch in the past but I can no longer recommend them. :angry:
 
#39 ·
HI Dave - Did you try contacting CPO? I've bought several of their tools from weedwackers to bench grinders to table saws and have been very satisfied with their customer service.:)
 
#37 ·
Even though it has been nearly 5 years since the switch issue was resolved in the new routers, I heard of people buying new routers 2 or 3 years ago still getting the old switch, largely because they were still in various stores warehouses. It makes me wonder if that is the case with your reconditioned router, and it wasn't replaced when they reconditioned. I have a feeling that they repackaged the wrong collet with your router as well. I got a second bosch 1617 for my b-day last week, and the collett definitely accepted 1/2" bits as expected. I haven't used it enough to validate that the switch issue has been resolved, though my first 1617 definitely has the old switch design. The old one now permanently stays in the router table so that switch will always be in the on position since the power is controlled by the switch on the router table.
 
#38 ·
Just to be sure, I disassembled the new switch before installing it, and it does indeed have a rubberized seal inside. Other than that it is identical to the old switch, including all the parts number markings on the outside. It is impossible to tell the difference between the unsealed switch and the sealed switch without taking them apart.

That collet thing really threw me for a loop. It was very close to 1/2" diameter but not one of my bits would fit. It was very disconcerting to get all set up to make sawdust with my new tool only to find that it wouldn't work at all. The new collet they sent out worked perfectly though, and they were very quick with that one...it arrived the day after I called.
 
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