Tablesaw basics. - Router Forums
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 03:12 AM Thread Starter
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Default Tablesaw basics.

Hi Chaps-

as per my last thread I have major dust probs/ do a job many time which extracts alot of wood.

3 main causes: my handheld router(s) (partially addressed by better vac pipe placament), chopsaw (limited addressed by vac attatch to back but still throws out extract by the bucket load).. and my circular saw.

Its my Csaw I want to consider: i use it a a lazymans way of cutting quick straights (& occasinal 25*angle cuts along too) along bblpy sheets, 3/4" pine, hardboard.. by just whacking on my straight edged, tapping home 3 securing pins to whatever wood Im cutting & zip along with the Csaw. Zipadeedoodah. But the dust it makes it an atrocious job every cut (& its never the safest method either with my 3 pins holding the rail). Fine if outside & a breeze but I dont have the luxury: this is all in a workshop. The bbply esp is nasty fine dust.

So I see some very reasoanably priced tablesaws, Im sure would be good enough as I dont put a huge workload on my Csaw really. I have seen a high quality one (with a blunt blade!) used in my timber merchants which altho the size of a Buick seems to gather all the dust & not spray it everywhere at all like my Csaw.

So the Q is: is one principle idea of the design of a tablesaw to mitigate/ collect (as much as it can/ Id hope vast majority) the dust by way of an accesspoint -underneath and close to- the blade?? and would a standard afaict W1-1/2" pipe (ie shopvac, henry or vax for eg: not taking 4" high-end dust extraction systems here, alas) width be a usual outlet thing to find underneath?

Thanks BigJ

Last edited by BIGjiLm; 06-19-2016 at 03:14 AM.
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 10:09 AM
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I have a 4" pipe going to my cabinet type table saw and it does very little to collect dust. A lot of the dust is created above the table and I'm planning on one day making a blade guard that has dust collection to try and collect that dust. A well designed guard would at least keep most of it from hitting me in the face. A couple of members have posted that drilling holes in the blade insert helped quite a bit. I haven't gotten around to trying that yet either but it's on my to do list. I still think I would need the dust control on my blade guard anyway.

Attaching something under the table top and close to the blade would likely be difficult to impossible since the lift and tilt screws are under there and anything you attach would probably get in the way of those.
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 10:25 AM
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I had a Ridgid contractor TS and enclosed the lower end and had pretty good results collecting dust. Then I bought a new Jet table saw which is enclosed at the factory and dust collection isn't near as good. I move all my tools to my Grizzly dust collector so the 4" hose is only about 10' long. All I can say do the best you can to control the dust and clean the rest up as you go.

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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 11:19 AM
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I have a 10" Delta tablesaw and use one of these mounted between the saw and the stand. It will clog if I don't turn the DC on when I do a lot of heavy cutting, but with the DC on it does a pretty good job. I think if your shop vac is a powerful one it would work with that too, but you are likely to get more loose sawdust from the blade. My saw didn't come with a blade guard, if I made one for that and attached that to the DC also I'd have almost no mess from the saw.
https://www.amazon.com/PSI-Woodworki...dust+coolector
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 11:37 AM
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My 10 inch Delta Table saw has just a box under it to catch what ever falls. I know I need to close it up some how, but with the motor hanging out the front like it does, I am not sure how to seal it all in.
Mine does not have a blade guard either, and it makes a huge mess on top of the saw when I use it.
I stop once in a while if cutting a lot of wood, and clean it up, plus I wear a mask and eye and ear protection.
Plus I have a box fan behind me to blow the fine stuff out the shop door.
Does anyone have plans on how to seal it up and to collect the dust from both the bottom and the top?
Just a picture would be enough, I can build from that.

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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 11:42 AM
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Ken, I looked up your attachment. That looks pretty good. Do you have a picture of the Big Gulp attached to your saw?
Just wondering how you get around the tilt mechanism and the drive belt.

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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 11:45 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kklowell View Post
I have a 10" Delta tablesaw and use one of these mounted between the saw and the stand. It will clog if I don't turn the DC on when I do a lot of heavy cutting, but with the DC on it does a pretty good job. I think if your shop vac is a powerful one it would work with that too, but you are likely to get more loose sawdust from the blade. My saw didn't come with a blade guard, if I made one for that and attached that to the DC also I'd have almost no mess from the saw.
https://www.amazon.com/PSI-Woodworki...dust+coolector
That looks a useful thing to have for a few applications (what specifically w'out a tablesaw yet I dont know tho).

So how would my timber yard (fab) workshop system work: I ask him to cut my bbply (huge 8' x 4' into four 4'x2' bits I can then get in the car).. so he 1st turns on the big 4" vac system, the pipe of which seems to go up, along the ceiling, but presumably at some point into the Buick sized Tsaw somewhere -underneath-.. cos I cant see any evidence of a 4" end of it anywhere topside while I wait next to. If its going underside, the I assume if its going to be effective (as it seems v. much to be) the end pipe must be close by the blade to catch the extract which I also presume fires -downwards- as a rule, and not out twds the operator?
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 11:59 AM
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I have a General International cabinet saw and ended up buying a hood from a SawStop model .
I'm going to cut my riving knife and have it welded to there's , thus giving me a way to extract that nasty dust above the saw .
Did a lot of research on making my own , but it wasn't worth the hassle after seeing that someone else did the R&D for me


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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 12:01 PM
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On my Bosch 4100 I closed the opening in the back of the saw,It sets on top of a cabinet, and put a 6" to the Dust collector straight out the back. This takes care of 95% of the dust. If I have the blade too high above the cut, I get more on top so try to not have the blade more than 1/4" above the cut.

On the 12" Craftsman,table saw I have it on a cabinet with a ramp under the saw to let the sawdust fall down the ramp.At the bottom of the ramp I have a 6" outlet for the dust collector, It seems to collect over 90% of the sawdust.

On the Radial Arm saw I have the blade buried in a box with a 6" outlet to the dust collector and as the blade comes out of the box, the sawdust is pulled off the teeth into the dust collector box. Also under the blade is a zero clearance insert with a dado that goes back to the box and pulls the sawdust from the teeth to the box. I get 99% dust collection from this set up.

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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-19-2016, 12:22 PM
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Big; there's two issues, the first being sawdust, the coarse stuff that falls to the floor, and the extremely fine particles which float in the air for a long time.
The larger particles are simply a housekeeping problem. The finest particles, say from one micron up, are the serious health risk.
So you're actually dealing with two separate problems. Air volume and air velocity are the two factors which address both of the created dust types which the dust collector is trying to collect.
If you box in the underside of the TS you still MUST allow make-up air into the enclosure; that's what picks up the particles and carries them into the piping.
simply enclosing the saw cabinet and sticking the DC pipe (of whatever size) will accomplish nothing. This is not a vacuum cleaner.
Having the dust pickup in the bottom of the tablesaw cabinet will collect a LOT of both types of dust, but unfortunately the spinning blade will carry lots of the finest particles around and kick them into the air. So collecting from both sources is ideal.
The bigger the dust collector, the more air volume it will draw and consequently a larger pipe diameter is needed to feed that air requirement.
The relationship between Velocity and Volume is a matter of physics. There are tables (calculations) for this stuff. A 1 1/2" hose is useless for a tablesaw. 4" with the appropriate Hp and proper sized impeller is the minimum for effective dust control.
Sure, a lot of members have fairly decent shopvac and separator systems that seem to work reasonably well, but I'm pretty sure most would admit that given the space and the cash, they'd gladly pop for a 2HP piped system. Me included; mine's a 1HP DC and it just isn't enough.
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