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post #21 of 39 (permalink) Old 10-31-2019, 09:18 PM
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Just to be clear Nick, I brought up the 1/4"vs 1/2" shank issue only because I already own a fairly comprehensive set of 1/4", not because there's anything inherently wrong with owning a set of 1/4" shanked bits.
In the spirit of full disclosure, they were an impulse buy because the price was red hot and they were DIMAR. If they'd been a brand i didn't recognize I might have kept on walking...
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post #22 of 39 (permalink) Old 10-31-2019, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by DaninVan View Post
Just to be clear Nick, I brought up the 1/4"vs 1/2" shank issue only because I already own a fairly comprehensive set of 1/4", not because there's anything inherently wrong with owning a set of 1/4" shanked bits.
In the spirit of full disclosure, they were an impulse buy because the price was red hot and they were DIMAR. If they'd been a brand i didn't recognize I might have kept on walking...

Understood...My post did not target your comments...I had included the comment because one of the posts in the thread had implied feeling comfortable with a 1/2" cheap set..."a rose by any other name..."
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GIVE A MAN A FISH and you feed him for a day.
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post #23 of 39 (permalink) Old 11-05-2019, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by harrysin View Post
Please show us, I don't recall seeing any of your projects Stick, I've shown many of mine using all types and qualities of router bits ranging from about $3.00 to $90.00 plus.
The photo shows the first time that I used this very low cost bit and all went well and I've used it a number of times since with the same excellent results. Even an experienced routologist like myself buys low cost bits that I don't envisage using a great deal.
I've posted them...
you must have missed them...
check my uploads...

that bit you show is yellow.. Yonico???
the bits in question are red w/ poor brazing and some of the edges show serration and chipped corners..

Is all carbide created equal? Nope. Can an ordinary woodworker determine a bit’s carbide quality by looking at it? Nope again. So how do you know? You can do your research and see what the manufacturer says about its carbide. (red bit doesn't offer a clue) You can also look at price. In router bits, as in so many aspects of life, you get what you pay for. For routing tasks that you will do often, a good quality bit will make your life easier. so take the money invested in your red bits and put it to better use- but better bits and get a way better return on your money...

This would have been the week that I'd have finished chewing thru the restraints...
If only new layers hadn't been added....

Stick....
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"SNORK Mountain Congressional Library and Taxidermy”
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post #24 of 39 (permalink) Old 11-05-2019, 11:05 PM Thread Starter
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I have Stick but there are no projects there, I'm afraid that we shall have to differ on this important subject, but I hope that routing beginners take notice from this experienced routologist.

Harry



Nothing but heaven itself is better than a friend who is really a friend. - Plautus






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post #25 of 39 (permalink) Old 11-05-2019, 11:32 PM
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aww c'mon Harry...
there's only 560 pages of uploads...
they're there..

okay...
you agree that wasting money is a good thing..
I'll agree that it isn't...
so now we both agree...

This would have been the week that I'd have finished chewing thru the restraints...
If only new layers hadn't been added....

Stick....
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"SNORK Mountain Congressional Library and Taxidermy”

Last edited by Stick486; 11-05-2019 at 11:47 PM.
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post #26 of 39 (permalink) Old 11-06-2019, 09:11 AM Thread Starter
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Stick, I can only see 11 uploads in your name, non of which is a project,please give me a link.

Here is my record:
You are currently using 1,023.89 MB to store 7,952 uploaded attachments.

Harry



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post #27 of 39 (permalink) Old 11-06-2019, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by harrysin View Post
Stick, I can only see 11 uploads in your name, non of which is a project,please give me a link.

Here is my record:
You are currently using 1,023.89 MB to store 7,952 uploaded attachments.
seriously Harry...
the way the search function works here...
I am not scrolling through 560 pages....
if it's that important to you have at it keep....

Here is my record...
Attachment Statistics
You are currently using 2.37 GB to store 5,598 uploaded attachments.

This would have been the week that I'd have finished chewing thru the restraints...
If only new layers hadn't been added....

Stick....
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"SNORK Mountain Congressional Library and Taxidermy”
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post #28 of 39 (permalink) Old 11-06-2019, 07:45 PM
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WOW...and I thought checking "statistics" was something boys did in the bathroom...!
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TEACH HIM HOW TO FISH and you feed him for his life time.
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post #29 of 39 (permalink) Old 11-06-2019, 09:37 PM
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Pretty much...
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post #30 of 39 (permalink) Old 11-06-2019, 11:22 PM
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I'm just too pro-American to let this lay.

"There is hardly anything in this world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and those people who consider price only, are this man's lawful prey. It is unwise to pay too much, but it's worse to pay too little. When you pay too much you lose a little money - that is all. * When you pay too little, you sometimes lose everything, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the thing it was bought to do.* * The common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot; it cannot be done. If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run, and if you do that you will have enough to pay for something better"
John Ruskin (1819 - 1900)

Pocketbook thinking can leave you empty handed.
Why would you want to buy from China? Why intentionally support China and not America? Seems pretty un-American to me. China is definitely not America's friend.
We are in debt to them up to our eyeballs, so, why do we continue to do business w/ China? Every time you buy Chinese, the debt gets worse. Presently, the trade deficit between our country and China is at 4:1 in their favor.

https://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c5700.html

This has resulted in a loss of an estimated 2.7 MILLION jobs since 2001

https://www.usnews.com/news/articles...na-in-10-years

There has been a history in the last decade plus of China buying up real estate and businesses in America. How can they do this? Easy, the American people have financed this with the purchase of their cheap and inferior goods. The profits due to the trade deficits have swelled the coffers of the Chinese.
We’ve lost real estate to China, so they can build their manufacturing sites, employing Chinese nationals on American soil. Here is an example of how they are slowly slipping into our country.

(http://www.eutimes.net/2011/06/china...ity-in-the-us/

Just one of many examples. Others include; general construction and road contracts, transportation, and infrastructure projects across the country.
Although not all bad. Some Chinese companies have recognized that despite the cheap labor pool available to them at home, it is cheaper overall to manufacture here. Land, utilities, cost of transportation, and tax incentives make it appealing to set up shop here, instead of China.

http://archive.fortune.com/2010/05/0...tune/index.htm

At first sight, this is great! However, when you dissect the end result, you have to ask the questions…what are the quality of the goods, how much of the profit goes off-shore instead of being reinvested and growing our economy, and are they really invested in just making a profit or contributing to an ultimate positive impact?
Every time they get a contract to do work here, they screw over Americans here at all cost: They use their own people, their own companies, their own materials and their own transportation.
Ever since the 1994-ish expansion of NAFTA, the door was left open for the Chinese invasion

https://www.theguardian.com/global-d...rty-free-trade.

NAFTA allowed for a tsunami of goods to be imported easily into the US. Outfits like Amazon got in bed with them (mysteriously 4 years ago) and the flow of counterfeit goods entering the US has expanded exponentially, and the US has done nothing to stop it.
The flood of Chinese goods is so voluminous that it is impossible to inspect, catch and stop the illegal imports. American made goods have suffered as Chinese knock-offs and out-right forgeries flood the market. US makers like Garrett Metal Detectors have devoted entire web pages on their sites on how to detect forgeries...
WTB those bits are red for a reason...

http://www.garrett.com/mediasite/counterfeiting_en.aspx.

Patent infringement robs Americans of billions or perhaps trillions of dollars every year.
Unsuspecting American consumers buy these products every year without realizing how they have been cheated. All they know is that the price was right, for them.
The American people have little or no recourse against faulty Chinese products. Everything from soup to nuts is copied. The inferior and yes, sometimes very dangerous, products are dumped onto the American consumer market.
Tainted, dangerous/deadly/mislabeled counterfeits of poultry, beef, fish, dairy products, automotive, pharmaceuticals, dog food, children’s toys, metals, construction materials flood the market. It is virtually impossible to stem the flow. Discover and stop the goods from being sold and something else pops up. Also, there is no way to easily, in fact it's next to impossible, to hold the Chinese manufacturers accountable for these dangerous goods. Do your homework – investigate for your own health and welfare and for that of your family.

The Chinese philosophy appears to be that stupid Americans will buy anything without question as long as the price is right, aka – cheap.
I already know what you’re going to say... “But I can’t find a comparable priced product made in the USA.” Have you even really looked? Probably not any further than your local Walmart, Target, Home Depot, Lowe’s, or Menards.

Back in the early 70’s I remember the influx of Chinese made nails. Unlike the ones made in the USA, one strike with a hammer and they would bend. Soon, all you could find were these Chinese-made nails in the stores. Why? There was a greater profit margin…more money to be made. Soon we came to accept the quality and price of the nails as normal, because that is all we could find in the stores. Did we stop making good quality steel nails in the USA (or Canada)? NO we didn't, they’re still being made. It is just that there is a higher profit margin on the Chinese product(s) that puts them on the self ahead of American products.

If you look around you can still find American made w/ much higher quality hardware, nails and screws. They are priced about the same or in some cases less than what is being offered in the big box stores. They are just not right in front of our noses!
Why do we not support our own economy and communities? One word... convenience. (and laziness too).

ABC News made an attempt to wake up the American people with an ongoing news segment, called, Made In America. They attempted to highlight what I just wrote above, but apparently it fell on deaf ears as they no longer highlight the available AMERICAN products.
As for you Harbor Freight addicts: It is a storehouse of poorly made knockoffs. How many times have you bought something from China that failed, right out of the box, when you needed it it performed poorly or mandated modifications?

If you don’t understand that there are tangible/intangible costs to everything, stop reading. If your time is worth nothing, what I’m saying won’t mean a thing to you and you won't care. It sure hurts to buy an item more than once too.
In reality, Chinese products cost a lot more than what you paid for them. If you think strictly with your wallet and you are hopefully paying attention, it won’t take long for you to realize that what you bought wasn’t such a good deal after all. If you buy the best you can, without losing sight of your wallet, the savings are huge. You might even save yourself a trip to the ER or at worst, the morgue. Certainly, you’ll save yourself one or more trips back to the store to get a Chinese item replaced. Don't forget to add the intangible costs to the ''good deal's'' price. More often than not, goods not from China are more durable, last longer and are more cost effective.

There is a lot to be said for free trade and buying goods from the cheapest sources anywhere in the world. Different parts of the world have different relative advantages, so we naturally want to buy oil from places where the oil is cheapest to produce, and buy our manufactured goods from places where it is cheaper to manufacture. But this kind of thinking is not the end of the story.
What this kind of thinking ignores is politics and the supremacist dreams of countries and political movements that hold American ideals in contempt. For them, economics is not a game. Instead, economic laws are simply rules in a much larger game, which is the pursuit of power and ''end game''.

Lenin said, “Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them.”
That strategy is with us just as much today as it was when Lenin said it. So the next time you decide to buy something, ask yourself: “When I buy this, will it help America and its true allies? Or will it strengthen countries whom we know despise our way of life? Are we paralyzing our own ability to act if a war breaks out?” Keep in mind that China is still a Communist nation.
For more than two decades, America has stood by while North Korea has pursued a nuclear ICBM program, despite the fact that North Korea is a small country with no strategic depth and an economy too weak to support a sustained war.

Why have we put up with this? The answer, in one word, is China.
Right now we are so dependent on China for manufactured goods that we don’t dare stop North Korea unless China gives consent. China is now in control of America’s foreign policy toward a country that makes videos about blowing us off the map.
If America’s economic relationship with China were to break down due to war with North Korea, China would be hurt. They would lose one of their biggest customers. But we would be far worse off. Aside from possibly dealing with the damage of a nuclear attack, we would be economically chopped off at the knees because we would be cut off from our biggest supplier of manufactured goods. Prices would skyrocket, our economy would go into a tailspin, and it would take years to develop alternatives.

We have been cornered politically, and most people don’t even realize it. Even worse, North Korea knows it and is getting more aggressive. Our passivity encourages them, just as Neville Chamberlain encouraged Hitler to take over Europe. In both cases, passivity is the gateway to a war of greater proportions than anything imaginable at an earlier phase.
Think about WHO you are buying from the next time you go to the store. It is more important than most people think.
When you vote w/ your wallet, merchants and manufacturers are quick to react. Push back, they'll listen or go out of business.

There is nothing political in my statement, intentionally or unintentionally.
I will put up my soap box now.
EOS

Someone knowledgeable about such said that in the Asian sets, only a couple of sizes of bits were properly hardened, "Because that's what most people use the most often."
"There is hardly anything in this world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and those people who consider price only, are this man's lawful prey. It is unwise to pay too much, but it's worse to pay too little. When you pay too much you lose a little money - that is all. * When you pay too little, you sometimes lose everything, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the thing it was bought to do.* * The common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot; it cannot be done.* *If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run, and if you do that you will have enough to pay for something better"
*
John Ruskin (1819 - 1900)

AND Harry..
those bits ARE junk...
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This would have been the week that I'd have finished chewing thru the restraints...
If only new layers hadn't been added....

Stick....
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"SNORK Mountain Congressional Library and Taxidermy”
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