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  Topic Review (Newest First)
06-13-2019 11:59 AM
Larry42 I'm not familiar with the term "furniture grade" but around here (USA) the better stuff is referred to as "industrial" board and has a designated Weight per cubic foot (damn Imperial measures.) Depending on what mill made it, it can vary considerably in characteristics.
06-04-2019 11:52 PM
thomas1389
Quote:
Originally Posted by vchiarelli View Post
Thomas - I help out a cabinetmaker from time to time who builds primarily kitchen cabinets, vanities, etc. out of melamine. He orders from a company called McFaddens and the melamine comes in various grades. I think the better/best grade is what they label as 400. It comes in white as well as other finishes. I'm not sure if there is a minimum order but he usually orders at least $1000 as I think that qualifies for free delivery (don't quote me on that). Here's a link.

https://mcfaddens.com/xsearch?ExtraS...hterm=melamine
Vince, I just googled them and found they're just up the road from me. Head Office Oakville. 4.4 km. from me. Just east of the 403 at the QEW. off the north service road. All kinds of material on their website. I'll call them and find out policy, availability, etc. They've got places all over. Thanks for the heads up.
06-04-2019 06:39 AM
vchiarelli
Quote:
Originally Posted by thomas1389 View Post
Recently I've read bits and pieces about cabinet construction and more than once there has been reference made to "furniture grade" particle board. By chance I was in Lowes this past week and got to talking to a rep from a company that made counter tops. Granite, Quartz and Laminate counter tops. I asked him about the furniture grade particle board and he said that's what they use on their laminate tops. He said there is such a thing and it's far and away superior to common particle board. Has anyone ever heard of this stuff ?
Thomas - I help out a cabinetmaker from time to time who builds primarily kitchen cabinets, vanities, etc. out of melamine. He orders from a company called McFaddens and the melamine comes in various grades. I think the better/best grade is what they label as 400. It comes in white as well as other finishes. I'm not sure if there is a minimum order but he usually orders at least $1000 as I think that qualifies for free delivery (don't quote me on that). Here's a link.

https://mcfaddens.com/xsearch?ExtraS...hterm=melamine
06-03-2019 11:57 PM
thomas1389 Recently I've read bits and pieces about cabinet construction and more than once there has been reference made to "furniture grade" particle board. By chance I was in Lowes this past week and got to talking to a rep from a company that made counter tops. Granite, Quartz and Laminate counter tops. I asked him about the furniture grade particle board and he said that's what they use on their laminate tops. He said there is such a thing and it's far and away superior to common particle board. Has anyone ever heard of this stuff ?
06-03-2019 06:08 AM
OldCurmudgeon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry42 View Post
Oldcrumudgeon has been tainted by having used/ bought stuff that used the cheap cheap board. We ship our store fixtures all over the country and to a few off shore locations.
Yes, my cabinets were "ready to assemble" from a big box store. Do you ship your fixtures already assembled? That's how mine went, and the packaging left something to be desired. In any case, as you said, it would be hard for me to get commercial grade stuff in the small quantities I use, even if I knew where to get it.
05-30-2019 03:38 PM
Larry42 Gmercer, As for experience I have run a commercial shop for 30+ years. We've had a Castle pocket screw machine for many years. It occasionally gets used on plywood but I'm not a fan of the stuff. 80% of what we build is made with Industrial grade particle with melamine or HPL (not the crap sold at the big box stores.) 8% MDF, 2% ply. Oldcrumudgeon has been tainted by having used/ bought stuff that used the cheap cheap board. We ship our store fixtures all over the country and to a few off shore locations. They make the trip just fine and hold up for years in rather hostile retail environments. I don't know where the home shop guy can buy industrial board, we get it through distribution yards.
As for why I hate to use ply: The stuff has voids (usually right where a screw goes,) it is prone to not being flat, it is never true to thickness. This last point is extremely important for production use. All of our products are parametrically designed in CAD. Optimized & Coded by CAM software, sent to CNC machines from the office server (Router, beam saw, edgebander, bore and insert & case clamp.) Face dowel holes are done on the Router, edge doweling is done on the bore & insert (slick machine, 8' long working area, reads a bar code, drills, blows the dust out, injects glue, drives a dowel, moves to the next location in 1.5 seconds. At the case clamp glue is injected with a gun that measures an exact amount. Drawer guides, hinge plates etc. are installed. Case is loosely knocked together and slid into the clamp. Push button, ass'l the next case. Time in clamp, about 3-4 minutes. Occasionally there will be a screwup and the wrong size case will be made. It becomes our test victim. Virtually all commercial work is frameless construction. Properly made it is very durable. I suspect few home shops have the equipment to do it.
05-02-2019 05:41 PM
LouisianaJoe When my daughter opened her business, I helped her make counter tops and some computer tables using 3/4" MDF and a Kreg pocket hole jig. I did glue the edges before using the pocket hole screws. After several years of use, they still look good. Keep in mind that the Kreg screws self thread when they are used. I also set the torque setting on my cordless screwdriver to make sure that the screws stop before stripping the wood. I put a back on the tables and counter tops to give them some extra strength.
05-02-2019 05:17 PM
OldCurmudgeon My advice: do not use particle board for anything that has to bear weight or might be moved (even a little). Screws just don't hold in it (especially if they are short and/or angled). They also don't age well - any humidity or temperature change will make them crumble. I had a horrible experience moving store-bought and self-assembled cabinets (not IKEA), which lived in my garage and I had to re-enforce twice over a 5-year period just so they don't fall apart. Nevertheless, 6 started the trip, none made it whole to the destination. I managed to salvage 3 and scrap the other 3, but I'd rather not have had to spend the time on this.
05-02-2019 09:14 AM
gmercer_48083 Bradley, My reason for posting the original question about pocket hole and particle board was because I felt the two didn't go well together. I will not be using particle board for this at all. Kreg's… "yes it will work" attitude towards this question does nothing to further knowledge about particle board. It shows me what is wrong with industry today. It would have been a feather in their cap to have told me why it should not be used. By admitting the Kreg pocket hole system is not the "do all", in this application would have been the HONEST reply.

I will be making two cabinets in the near future from 3/4" plywood, which will be easier to make, more durable, easier on my tools and lighter. Considering the cost is 3 times more to make... it still comes in at around $180 for two cabinets with hardware and finish.
05-01-2019 07:26 PM
Straightlines For the record, IKEA’s cabs cases are all made of HPL particleboard, not MDF, not plywood, so while it is particleboard, it is not at all the same as what you are planning:

1. The HPL protects and strengthens the particleboard
2. They use a special fastening system designed for that very application, which includes specific particleboard screws in pinned AND pre-drilled holes and these mating holes are precisely drilled in the mating pieces by using special 32mm cab system jigs. They also utilize rabbeted and screwed joints
3. I always glue my IKEA cases together as I screw them tight
4. You’ll notice that IKEA does NOT use particleboard for doors (they use lighter solid/plywood combinations) and your doors are big; too big for this.

Believe it or not, this is what particleboard is made for (in factory settings), but the added effort and specialized fasteners and jigging just don’t seem worth it for a one-off project. This is especially true because if you can pull it off, the best you’ll have is a cheap-ass crap cabinet that is not robust.

It’s true, we get what we pay for in this world. What are you going to do if you crack or break or blow out something? You’ll get to go buy some 3/4” shop grade plywood 🙁 and start over. What’s your time worth to ya? Pocket screws in 3/4” plywood is a slam dunk, even though I would make it all dadoed and rabbeted/finish nail or staple + glue construction.

Good luck.
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