Help - where do you locate your dust filter? - Page 3 - Router Forums
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post #21 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-28-2012, 07:04 PM Thread Starter
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Excellent AaronRC4:

Thanks for the heads up on the Dylos. I took a look at the price though and by the time I bring it into Canada, it will be prohibitive.

Ok. would you do an experiment for me please. Take a bright lamp and turn it on in your shop. Cut some MDF or something and see how much dust you show in the beam of light from the lamp. Now measure the air with your Dylos. Run your filter stack until you do not see particles in the lamp beam and measure again. Please tell me what you saw and the values you measured.

For me, I routed a piece of MDF. I had dust all over the place. Within the first foot of the lamp in the light beam there was a fair amount of dust. I ran my filter for two hours and went back and took another look. There was no dust in the beam of light. I'd love to know how that measures on your Dylos. I'm sure that this is a pretty objective evaluation but it's all I've got.

Thanks for the help.

Ron

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post #22 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-28-2012, 08:07 PM
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The question is still out there, where do you find your filters for King air filtering system, well king Canada on their website now list the two filters for their 2 models
(I am not allowed yet to post the url yet)
Now you have to order them through a seller of King Tools
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post #23 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-29-2012, 05:28 AM Thread Starter
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Hi Andre:

I don't know where you are so I'll give you a contact:

TegsTools.com

Call them (they have a watts number if necessary) and they will ship to you. If you're going to get a good price, theirs will probably be amongst the best. BTW, Home Hardware can also order filters for you. I think the warehouse in St. Jacobs stocks them.

That said, the King Canada model is only a 5 micron and 1 micron filtering system for probably a good chunk of change. I've effectively replaced it with my garage sale box fan and filter stack.

I'm gradually updating my dust collection article. There's part of it in place at the moment in the woodworking articles section of this forum.





Quote:
Originally Posted by camerio1 View Post
The question is still out there, where do you find your filters for King air filtering system, well king Canada on their website now list the two filters for their 2 models
(I am not allowed yet to post the url yet)
Now you have to order them through a seller of King Tools

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post #24 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-29-2012, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allthunbs View Post
Hi Andre:

I don't know where you are so I'll give you a contact:

TegsTools.com

Call them (they have a watts number if necessary) and they will ship to you. If you're going to get a good price, theirs will probably be amongst the best. BTW, Home Hardware can also order filters for you. I think the warehouse in St. Jacobs stocks them.

That said, the King Canada model is only a 5 micron and 1 micron filtering system for probably a good chunk of change. I've effectively replaced it with my garage sale box fan and filter stack.

I'm gradually updating my dust collection article. There's part of it in place at the moment in the woodworking articles section of this forum.
Thanks, I will soon have post #10 so I will be able to update my profile.
I live in the Quebec City area, Valcartier to be exact, it is 30 minutes north of the center of the city. There is a few Home Hardware in my area and I have a Canac-Marquis hardware near me that sells King tools, but that part for the air filter has to be order, the do not stock it.
I have cleaned to filter with my compressor (outside of the shop, of course ) and I think they still have some life yet.
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post #25 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-29-2012, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allthunbs View Post
Excellent AaronRC4:

Thanks for the heads up on the Dylos. I took a look at the price though and by the time I bring it into Canada, it will be prohibitive.

Ok. would you do an experiment for me please. Take a bright lamp and turn it on in your shop. Cut some MDF or something and see how much dust you show in the beam of light from the lamp. Now measure the air with your Dylos. Run your filter stack until you do not see particles in the lamp beam and measure again. Please tell me what you saw and the values you measured.

For me, I routed a piece of MDF. I had dust all over the place. Within the first foot of the lamp in the light beam there was a fair amount of dust. I ran my filter for two hours and went back and took another look. There was no dust in the beam of light. I'd love to know how that measures on your Dylos. I'm sure that this is a pretty objective evaluation but it's all I've got.

Thanks for the help.

Ron
================================================== ==============

Brilliant idea! Never thought of a do it your self dust tester but I think it can be done on the cheap. I'm a retired EE and a genuine DIYer in the shop. I save a huge amount of money by forward thinking.In fact I enjoy making tooling and stuff more then building furniture or cabinets.

All of the dust particle counters work on the same principle of using a laser and measuring the light from back scattering. For our needs we don't need a $4600 lab instrument. Dylos charges about $200 for the 1 micron. I bought the .5 Micron unit a long time ago . They did an excellent job of getting the price down but its still a bit much for a home shop.

I have a very large back order of all sorts of projects Wife, kids etc so probably about 6 months before I can complete this. It takes me about 3 tries to get a project where I like it. I can already see a bunch of ways to do this in my head. A really fun project. The killer is measuring the back scatter in a wide enough range to be useable. It might be as easy as using a photo transistor and a Harbor freight Digital Volt meter. Cost here for parts about $10-$20. Things rarely work out but we shall see. Keep in contact with me.

If there are any EE's here jump in.

I also have a lot of test gear for airflow. If you have duct work you can roughly estimate your CFM by making a Slack Tube manometer. That is simply a 1/4" clear plastic tube about 4' long bent in a U shape. Fill it half way with water and stick one end inside the duct . This will give you a pressure reading( SP) which relates to CFM.

The matching CFM instrument is also a bit pricey at about $120 but CFM estimates are probably good enough for most folk. No way to DIY for the CFM meter that I know of.
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post #26 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-29-2012, 04:46 PM
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Hello!

Interesting challenge to measure dust in the air...
But I won't try. as long as there is dust on my shelves;
I'd better spend my limited time trying to ameliorate:

1- Dust extraction witch one of the source of the dust problem.

2- Air cleaning , and MERV 12 is insuficiant.

My opinion is to clean the air where i breath it, that's mostly around the work bench.

So, i want to inject from top some clean air where i stand.This what i will breath.
That's consistent with a surgy installation flowing clean air to "work area".

So HEPA looks a lot better than merv12.
If we got EE around, what about electrostatic dust-collection.
easy to make a 20 kv power suply.
I think that's the ultimate way of catching litle things...
There is also another factor that's first to recuce air speed , by increasing the square section, then particles with low mechanichal energies would get easier to catch.

I don't care of having a 3 cubical meter filter, if works better.

Regards
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post #27 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 07:45 AM Thread Starter
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Bonjour Andre,

Quote:
Originally Posted by camerio1 View Post
Thanks, I will soon have post #10 so I will be able to update my profile.
Go to the introductions forum and answer 10 newbies with a hello and welcome. You can get your 10 in a few minutes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by camerio1 View Post
I live in the Quebec City area, Valcartier to be exact, it is 30 minutes north of the center of the city.
What is your rank?

Quote:
Originally Posted by camerio1 View Post
There is a few Home Hardware in my area and I have a Canac-Marquis hardware near me that sells King tools, but that part for the air filter has to be order, the do not stock it.
Typical. You might try Nordique in Quebec City. I don't like them but they sometimes stock supplies. They have a lot of router bits but they don't use routers so they don't stock bits that are usable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by camerio1 View Post
I have cleaned to filter with my compressor (outside of the shop, of course ) and I think they still have some life yet.
I would recommend rather than use the air compressor, use the dust brush (the one with long bristles) on your vacuum cleaner. The bristles will keep the filter material far from the suction but it will disturb the dust so the vacuum can suck it up. It might work better. That's what I do with mine.

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post #28 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 07:54 AM Thread Starter
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Hi Aaron:

Before you undertake the electronic solution, could you try the experiment. This is so that guys around the world can have an idea of how bad their environment really is and perhaps then qualify why to look to solutions and perhaps measurements systems.

I'm going to input into your thinking below but give me a bit of time to think it through. The laser method is quite predictable so that's why it works. The equivalent is a strong light source against a dark(?) background. Can that be compressed and the light attenuation measured?????

Let me think about this some more.

Ron


Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronRC4 View Post
================================================== ==============

Brilliant idea! Never thought of a do it your self dust tester but I think it can be done on the cheap. I'm a retired EE and a genuine DIYer in the shop. I save a huge amount of money by forward thinking.In fact I enjoy making tooling and stuff more then building furniture or cabinets.

All of the dust particle counters work on the same principle of using a laser and measuring the light from back scattering. For our needs we don't need a $4600 lab instrument. Dylos charges about $200 for the 1 micron. I bought the .5 Micron unit a long time ago . They did an excellent job of getting the price down but its still a bit much for a home shop.

I have a very large back order of all sorts of projects Wife, kids etc so probably about 6 months before I can complete this. It takes me about 3 tries to get a project where I like it. I can already see a bunch of ways to do this in my head. A really fun project. The killer is measuring the back scatter in a wide enough range to be useable. It might be as easy as using a photo transistor and a Harbor freight Digital Volt meter. Cost here for parts about $10-$20. Things rarely work out but we shall see. Keep in contact with me.

If there are any EE's here jump in.

I also have a lot of test gear for airflow. If you have duct work you can roughly estimate your CFM by making a Slack Tube manometer. That is simply a 1/4" clear plastic tube about 4' long bent in a U shape. Fill it half way with water and stick one end inside the duct . This will give you a pressure reading( SP) which relates to CFM.

The matching CFM instrument is also a bit pricey at about $120 but CFM estimates are probably good enough for most folk. No way to DIY for the CFM meter that I know of.

Allthunbs
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post #29 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 12:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allthunbs View Post
Hi Aaron:

Before you undertake the electronic solution, could you try the experiment. This is so that guys around the world can have an idea of how bad their environment really is and perhaps then qualify why to look to solutions and perhaps measurements systems.

I'm going to input into your thinking below but give me a bit of time to think it through. The laser method is quite predictable so that's why it works. The equivalent is a strong light source against a dark(?) background. Can that be compressed and the light attenuation measured?????

Let me think about this some more.

Ron
No problem with the experiment and I know what I will see, a bunch of dust in an air stream. I've done this a long time ago. There is no way I can describe verbally what I see. A" whole lot of dust" doesn't mean much and a" little bit of dust" is the same. I have to have a number or indicator.

More thoughts on my el cheapo meter . I think maybe 3 led lights indicating poor, fair and ok is all that's needed.

Some day when I get time. Old guys don't get much done . If not getting much done is a qualifier then I'm older then God.
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post #30 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 12:28 PM
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Got a call yesterday from a long time friend who's a hobby woodworker like me and also a smoker. Has nasal cancer but lungs are clear but typically congested. Cough cough. The Doc says give it up- ie smoking and wood working. They are going to remove his sinus membranes which means he will have no sense of smell anymore

I just Googled occupational cancer-wood workers for the first time. If your queasy on this subject of cancer, don't do it. The articles claim woodworkers nasal cancer is 500 -1000 times higher then the general population. We talk about finger loss and a bunch of safety stuff that nothing to compared to this in numbers.

So that telephone call was a wake up for me and I'm going to take another hard look at dust control in the shop. If your shop is in the house you can wipe out your wife and kids also. Think about it.

Bill Pentz has a huge site on dust control. Worth reading.
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