So, where do I go from here÷ - Router Forums
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 08:53 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Country: United States
First Name: Bob
Posts: 9
 
Default So, where do I go from here÷

To say that I'm an absolute beginner would overstating my qualifications. This is something that I want to do, but I'm easing my way into it.

Tomorrow, I'm buying a Craftsman 171.25443 router table ($20). This may be putting the cart before the horse, since I don't even own a router yet. This brings up my first question here on Router Forums: which routers will work with this table?

Hopefully, there are those of you who are familiar with this table who can offer some advise. I'm on a very limited budget, so I would like to keep it as inexpensive as possible.

Thanks,

Bob
dawsonbob is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 09:44 PM
Registered User
 
wbh1963's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Country: United States
First Name: Bill
Posts: 766
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dawsonbob View Post
To say that I'm an absolute beginner would overstating my qualifications. This is something that I want to do, but I'm easing my way into it.

Tomorrow, I'm buying a Craftsman 171.25443 router table ($20). This may be putting the cart before the horse, since I don't even own a router yet. This brings up my first question here on Router Forums: which routers will work with this table?

Hopefully, there are those of you who are familiar with this table who can offer some advise. I'm on a very limited budget, so I would like to keep it as inexpensive as possible.

Thanks,

Bob
Bob,

I didn't spend a lot of time trying to dig up a manual on that product because I found the exploded parts diagram on sears parts direct, and gave me a general idea of the unit's size and capabilities.

I would describe it as a basic bench top unit that doesn't use a discrete mounting plate. By that I mean the router is fastened to the underside of the top with countersunk screws that penetrate the top and thread into the base of the router.

20 bucks is about right, assuming it isn't missing too many parts... There are literally hundreds of different model routers that will work just fine in that table.
If all of the parts are there, considering it has a metal top and a dust extraction friendly fence, I might have bought it myself if I had wandered into it at a yard sale.

The parts list described the table top as cast, so I'm guessing it is metal of some sort. That is both good and bad. Metal doesn't wear out like MDF with holes drilled through it can, but it can be warped/bent if abused. There are also those who say metal topped router tables can stain wood that is passed over them.

Back to picking a router. Getting one where all the holes line up is a real crap shoot.

Sadly, the manual will only reference the models they were still selling at the time the manual was printed, when it comes to describing models that will work in it. Odds are there are hundreds of others that will fit fine, though they may be a different brand or made earlier/later than the table itself was.

Searching ebay and/or Craig's list for the table's model number might identify other ones for sale that have a router included. Sadly, just because someone is trying to sell both of them at the same time doesn't guarantee all the holes will line up.

Drilling new/more holes into a metal top is possible, but more challenging. When I needed to adapt a router to a metal top, I made an adapter plate out of 3/8" ply.

With the router in hand that I wanted to use, I remvoed the plastic sub plate from the bottom of the router. It has holes right where they are supposed to be. Just setting it on top of the table I wanted to use it on quickly confirmed 2 out of three did line up, but I wanted all 3. An 8" x 8" piece of ply did the trick just fine.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	wbh-2nd-router-table-topside.jpg
Views:	139
Size:	322.3 KB
ID:	52636  

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG0456.jpg
Views:	118
Size:	298.3 KB
ID:	52637  


wbh1963 is flowing with the grain in Arlington, Washington, USA

A day without curls is like a day without sunshine!
wbh1963 is offline  
post #3 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 10:16 PM
Forum Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Country: United States
First Name: Bj
Posts: 23,786
       
Default

Hi Bob

Put your 20.oo back in your pocket and get the table below,then you will be happy camper ,I'm a big fan of the Craftsman stuff but NOT the cheap router table that you are looking at,it will turn you off from using the router in short order..

T10432 Router Table with Stand

http://cdn0.grizzly.com/manuals/t10432_m.pdf
=======
Quote:
Originally Posted by dawsonbob View Post
To say that I'm an absolute beginner would overstating my qualifications. This is something that I want to do, but I'm easing my way into it.

Tomorrow, I'm buying a Craftsman 171.25443 router table ($20). This may be putting the cart before the horse, since I don't even own a router yet. This brings up my first question here on Router Forums: which routers will work with this table?

Hopefully, there are those of you who are familiar with this table who can offer some advise. I'm on a very limited budget, so I would like to keep it as inexpensive as possible.

Thanks,

Bob



"It's fine to disagree with other members as long as you respect their opinions"

Marc Sommerfeld Tools ,Videos
http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT-n...RWaEpMA/videos

Find all threads started by bobj3
http://www.routerforums.com/search.php?searchid=944097


bobj3 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 10:17 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Country: United States
First Name: Bob
Posts: 9
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wbh1963 View Post
Bob,

I didn't spend a lot of time trying to dig up a manual on that product because I found the exploded parts diagram on sears parts direct, and gave me a general idea of the unit's size and capabilities.

I would describe it as a basic bench top unit that doesn't use a discrete mounting plate. By that I mean the router is fastened to the underside of the top with countersunk screws that penetrate the top and thread into the base of the router.

20 bucks is about right, assuming it isn't missing too many parts... There are literally hundreds of different model routers that will work just fine in that table.
If all of the parts are there, considering it has a metal top and a dust extraction friendly fence, I might have bought it myself if I had wandered into it at a yard sale.

The parts list described the table top as cast, so I'm guessing it is metal of some sort. That is both good and bad. Metal doesn't wear out like MDF with holes drilled through it can, but it can be warped/bent if abused. There are also those who say metal topped router tables can stain wood that is passed over them.

Back to picking a router. Getting one where all the holes line up is a real crap shoot.

Sadly, the manual will only reference the models they were still selling at the time the manual was printed, when it comes to describing models that will work in it. Odds are there are hundreds of others that will fit fine, though they may be a different brand or made earlier/later than the table itself was.

Searching ebay and/or Craig's list for the table's model number might identify other ones for sale that have a router included. Sadly, just because someone is trying to sell both of them at the same time doesn't guarantee all the holes will line up.

Drilling new/more holes into a metal top is possible, but more challenging. When I needed to adapt a router to a metal top, I made an adapter plate out of 3/8" ply.

With the router in hand that I wanted to use, I remvoed the plastic sub plate from the bottom of the router. It has holes right where they are supposed to be. Just setting it on top of the table I wanted to use it on quickly confirmed 2 out of three did line up, but I wanted all 3. An 8" x 8" piece of ply did the trick just fine.
Thank You, Bill,

I just ran across a listing for this table on Craig's List, and figured that for $20 I couldn't go wrong, since most of the tables I've seen go for a whole lot more. The picture in the listing showed a table (with a metal top) that was used, but in really good shape. I emailed the guy about it and he says it is in great shape and has all the parts. Sounded like a bargain to me, so I jumped on it.

Your telling me that there are probably hundreds of routers that will fit the table is a load off my mind. It may take awhile, but I'm sure I can find one on Craig's list or Ebay. Once I have the table I'll have a better idea.

Thanks for the idea of making a mounting from plywood. If I can't find a router that bolts directly onto the table, that may be the way to go.

Thanks for helping an absolute newbie.
dawsonbob is offline  
post #5 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 10:27 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Country: United States
First Name: Bob
Posts: 9
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobj3 View Post
Hi Bob

Put your 20.oo back in your pocket and get the table below,then you will be happy camper ,I'm a big fan of the Craftsman stuff but NOT the cheap router table that you are looking at,it will turn you off from using the router in short order..

=======
Thank You for the suggestion. It's a nice looking unit, but I'm afraid it's a little out of my reach at the moment. The $20 Craftsman is doable for me, but that's about all. When you live on a embarrassingly small Social Security pension, you have to watch every penny.

Once I gain some skill with the cheap table, I'll move on up to the one you showed (which does look like a good deal).

Best,

Bob
dawsonbob is offline  
post #6 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 10:32 PM
Retired Moderator
 
Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Country: United States
First Name: Mike
Posts: 11,921
 
Send a message via Skype™ to Mike
Default

This sounds like one of the step stool router tables. They work with most Craftsman routers. It will get you started but it will not take long for you to wish you had listened to BJ and went after the Grizzly table. One big advantage is you can use any router with it, not just one brand. Adjustments are night and day different.

I will mention that the only negative feedback I have ever had on the forums is when I said these stamped steel tables worked great as step stools and not much else. You can work with them but they would be my very last choice. You are better off building the economy table top in the sticky threads.

Mike
"Living in the D" (this means Detroit!)
"It's fine to disagree with other members as long as you respect their opinions"

Last edited by Mike; 05-24-2012 at 10:35 PM.
Mike is offline  
post #7 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 10:47 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Country: United States
First Name: Bob
Posts: 9
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike View Post
This sounds like one of the step stool router tables. They work with most Craftsman routers. It will get you started but it will not take long for you to wish you had listened to BJ and went after the Grizzly table. One big advantage is you can use any router with it, not just one brand. Adjustments are night and day different.

I will mention that the only negative feedback I have ever had on the forums is when I said these stamped steel tables worked great as step stools and not much else. You can work with them but they would be my very last choice. You are better off building the economy table top in the sticky threads.
Hi, Mike,

Looking at the picture, it does look rather like a footstool. Getting me started while I learn is about all I need out of this thing. Later, when I'm more accomplished, I can save up for the Grizzly that BJ suggested.

See — I've only been a member for a couple of hours, and I'm already learning things. Before coming here I didn't even know that the Grizzly table existed.

Best,

Bob
dawsonbob is offline  
post #8 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 11:13 PM
Registered User
 
wbh1963's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Country: United States
First Name: Bill
Posts: 766
 
Default

Jigs, you sure to when (and how!) to toss a link into the mix... Thanks man!

I should point out that the table I was willing to make a plate for is a 'style' clone of the one you recommended. By that I just mean it is free standing, bout three feet tall and basic. My experience with bench top units is that if you don't bolt them down, they are so light they are all over the place from vibrations and tip easily when routing larger sized work pieces.

The Grizzly has an interchangeable mounting plate and a nicer fence (t-track feather board friendly) than the Wolfcraft, and is well worth the money.

I picked up that Wolfcraft on 'the list' for 30.00 and know that in my area, similar units come and go in the neighborhood of 50.00 to 75.00.

Though the bench top (MDF) unit that was my first cost me 50, it included a 1.5HP (w the 15bit HF set) router with it.... I knew it was abysmal in quality going in and that better units would follow. Had I actually expected it to 'perform' well, the experiment might have scared me away from routing. The only thing that scares me away from routing is the noise!

The truth is, I just wanted to learn from the 'bottom up'. When the junker's are no longer good enough for the moment (and not getting used some as a result) selling them off at about what I paid for them won't be tough.

I just like to keep the lost of learning down. The stand up Kreg unit and a 3.x HP Hitachi might have satisfied me for life, but that would be a 450 to 600 experiment, if and only if the wind was blowing right.....

Perhaps, one of the things I learned by reading your posts before I bought my first router (or table) is that '1 router would NEVER be enough' for a tool freak like me... Knowing that I go hot/cold (in when/how much I use tools in general) makes me overly cautious when it comes to shelling out the Benjamins.

$50.00 cash with some patience can be expected to win a 'bottom of the food chain table, router included' off the list with ease, largely because the orange box sells the Ryobi kit brand new for 99.00... I heard the guy in my local pawn shop offer 15.00 for the router and refuse the table outright......it isn't worth their shelf space compared to the rest of the used tool spectrum.

Perhaps one of the reasons I can appreciate 'really cheap tools' as long as they work to some degree, is they make it easier to appreciate the really nice stuff.. Being willing (and able) to jump in with both feet and modify them to purpose factors in to that as well.

So here it is Jigs, the question you get asked so often....

How many routers and tables are you up to today!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobj3 View Post
Hi Bob

Put your 20.oo back in your pocket and get the table below,then you will be happy camper ,I'm a big fan of the Craftsman stuff but NOT the cheap router table that you are looking at,it will turn you off from using the router in short order..

T10432 Router Table with Stand

http://cdn0.grizzly.com/manuals/t10432_m.pdf
=======

wbh1963 is flowing with the grain in Arlington, Washington, USA

A day without curls is like a day without sunshine!
wbh1963 is offline  
post #9 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 11:14 PM
Moderation Team
 
Cherryville Chuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Country: Canada
First Name: Charles
Posts: 14,952
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike View Post
This sounds like one of the step stool router tables. They work with most Craftsman routers. It will get you started but it will not take long for you to wish you had listened to BJ and went after the Grizzly table. One big advantage is you can use any router with it, not just one brand. Adjustments are night and day different.

I will mention that the only negative feedback I have ever had on the forums is when I said these stamped steel tables worked great as step stools and not much else. You can work with them but they would be my very last choice. You are better off building the economy table top in the sticky threads.
Mike, I have to disagree with you on this one. I had one of those tables and I didn't even think it would make a decent stepstool. Not sturdy enough for my generous dimensions.

Someone I consider a master woodworker once told me that a master woodworker is not someone who never makes mistakes. He is someone who is able to cover them up so that no one can tell.
Cherryville Chuck is online now  
post #10 of 36 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 11:39 PM
Registered User
 
wbh1963's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Country: United States
First Name: Bill
Posts: 766
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dawsonbob View Post
Thank You, Bill,

I just ran across a listing for this table on Craig's List, and figured that for $20 I couldn't go wrong, since most of the tables I've seen go for a whole lot more. The picture in the listing showed a table (with a metal top) that was used, but in really good shape. I emailed the guy about it and he says it is in great shape and has all the parts. Sounded like a bargain to me, so I jumped on it.
Looking at the other replies and your reactions to them suggests that you can see the wisdom reflected by their highlighting how low end many of the 'foot stool' class tables are!. There are some with nicer tops, but they still don't have enough mass
ore height to make running large work pieces over them a sound plan.

I think the important thing here is that you have reasonable expectations of what you are getting and you don't intend for it to be an 'end all' that lasts forever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dawsonbob View Post
Your telling me that there are probably hundreds of routers that will fit the table is a load off my mind. It may take awhile, but I'm sure I can find one on Craig's list or Ebay. Once I have the table I'll have a better idea.
I'll stand by that quick fire guess, but only because there are thousands of different models out there in the used market. 1 out of 10 will fit, which means 9 out of 10 don't. That is a huge reason for interchangeable plates in table design.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dawsonbob View Post
Thanks for the idea of making a mounting from plywood. If I can't find a router that bolts directly onto the table, that may be the way to go.
Seeing pictures of hundreds of tables that people had built from scratch is what hooked me on this forum when I got here. IMHO, selecting the router should be based on more important things that whether it fits into that table easily.

One of your other replies in this thread mentioned this is a stepping stone table any way and meant to be a learning experience. Price, and the number of bits you can get with it seem more important in the scenario you have described. Don't expect the finest carbon steel in cheap bit sets (whether purchased new or with a router), but at the end of the day, without a bit, all they make is noise!


Quote:
Originally Posted by dawsonbob View Post
Thanks for helping an absolute newbie.
You are quite welcome. Compared to Mike and Jigs, I am still an absolute newbie myself...

By getting the users here to talk, and interacting with us after we do, offers a learning experience to many more than the original poster....that suggests that thanks are due to you as well in return.

Routers and I have a classic love hate thing going on. Considering the words written by the real guru types around here is what keeps me growing towards becoming the crafter I would like to be. As I slowly get better at using them, I become more willing to tolerate the noise...

wbh1963 is flowing with the grain in Arlington, Washington, USA

A day without curls is like a day without sunshine!
wbh1963 is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Router Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome