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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So here’s the saga…it may be old news to some of you…

I finally ordered the Garrett Super Scanner V from Amazon. I figured it was about time as I plan to start using reclaimed wood in the near future. It seemed that I could practice a bit to make sure the real run would not cost me blades for the 735…

When it came in I opened the Amazon box, carefully packaged BTW, and found a white box with a serial number and barcode on it (see picture). Inside the white box was a brand new shiny plastic Super Scanner V…or so I thought…and a manual for a Super Scanner (feel the suspense building now…?)

After plugging it in and turning it on I got the tell-tale beep and green light. I wondered, however, why the manual was labeled Super Scanner (no “V”). When I went to plug in the 9-volt battery I naturally looked for +- markings but none were to be had. So trial and error and second try it worked. (Good thing it didn’t take three…). So far, problem #1…no markings for battery.

I quickly grabbed some screws (drywall, stainless, deck, small, long, etc…) and started testing. I also pulled some knives and forks and keys and anything metal I could find within arms reach. It seemed fine until I tried to find a staple. “What the hey…?”, I said… I laid the staple on a piece of oak and no beep…I laid the staple on the Garrett and no beep…WHAAAATTTT…? Obviously I wouldn’t expect to need the Garrett to find a fork in a piece of wood…right…?

So I made a couple of calls and found some inconsistencies…I had a 2-position switch instead of three…HHMMM…and inconsistent test results…

So I then called Garrett and found some interesting information…I HAD A KNOCKOFF…

Apparently, there are two frauds out there…

1. some enterprising young lads/lasses has bought up a potful of the original Super Scanners (Model Nr. 1165180) and are selling them as Super Scanner V’s. Of course, this requires relabeling the plastic to say “Super Scanner V”…and relabeling the back so it shows a three position switch…beep, off, vibrate… And then it would take reprinting a serial number and the model number…and so on…


2. just plain ole knockoff…junk on the inside, cheap plastic, appropriate labels…but NOT GARRETT…BTW, the labels are not stick on…they are silkscreened just like the real McCoy…


Both will let the buyer think they have a Super Scanner V…Model Number 1165190

What I found out…

1. Super Scanner "V" serial numbers start with 5…not 3. If you have a “V”, I would recommend contacting Garrett to verify but you will likely have been using a fake… The serial number on the box did not match the serial number on the unit. The serial number on the unit is probably the same for all, or many, of the fakes…


2. “V”s have a three position switch…beep, off, vibrate…if your scanner says “V” but only a two position on/off rocker…guess what…


3. Amazon will refund your money (in accordance with their policy)…they may just tell you to dispose of the one you bought. They wanted mine back because they don’t believe they have ever heard of this fraud…RIGHT…


4. Almost all sellers that are likely to be fake seem to be using the same pictures in their ads…might be a first clue…


5. A youtube video indicates law enforcement and airport security might be using these fakes…not likely as I don’t believe the TSA is buying from sellers on Amazon or eBay…but “who knows what evil lurks in the minds of men…” (As if only men are bad…) (Do a search for "super scanner v fake")




I’m guessing Garrett and Amazon are probably not getting a lot of calls…people are buying and using and probably not aware… I’m not insulting anybody…just sayin’…

The best part of the story is I’ve been chuckling about this since I found out I was had…a novelty…or maybe I’ve been had in the past and don’t know it…

“only the Shadow knows”



I hope this was enough detail…question away, hose-A…
 

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Thanks for the heads up. I do have the real thing, but this reminded me to move it to the jointer and planer area so it's handy. It's probably a good idea to scan all wood going through those two machines, even the good stuff from a wood supplier can pick up a fragment big enough to chip a blade.
 

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wonderful...
do you know or can you tell what the country of origin for the knock offs...
 

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Sounds like it isn't a knockoff, but a re-label of a cheaper model bought in bulk (probably made and purchased out the factory back door in a third world country).
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Sounds like it isn't a knockoff, but a re-label of a cheaper model bought in bulk (probably made and purchased out the factory back door in a third world country).
Yup...that was one of the two ways they pass off fakes...relabeled older version and out/out knockoff...
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
wonderful...
do you know or can you tell what the country of origin for the knock offs...
Nope...cannot...seller ships to Amazon and they repackage it when Amazon sells it...

Amazon said they would "take care of the seller"...I think it was Rootproduct...don't see them today.

But a new seller "Harlows lot" just launched that sells the "V"...

Wanna Bet it's the same seller...? After Amazon kicked them off...?
 
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Nope...cannot...seller ships to Amazon and they repackage it when Amazon sells it...

does the box or scanner say where it was made???
 

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According to law it must have country of origin.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·

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that is what it says but was it???
Do you really think, that, the forgers are going to leave Made in China visible?

They went to a lot of trouble to screen all of the Garrett graphics for the V onto the, obviously not a Garrett V, scanner.

I don't believe for a minute that Amazon did not know that the vendor was shady, and I agree with Nick, they just opened up under a different name. I am willing to bet they are selling the same counterfeit goods and Amazon knows that they are still in business.

The crucial evidence here is that the serial number on the real Garrett starts with a #5. The question is, how long before the counterfeiters catch on and change the silk screen.

Personally, I prefer to deal mail order with only reputable companies which have a good reputation and are willing to provide the proper customer service in the event of a problem. Although I have purchased small ticket items from Amazon, I am really leery of a company that markets for dozens of potentially "fly by night" companies. I generally find, that, if I find it on Amazon with multiple vendors I can go directly to the actual (reputable) vendor and get the item at the same or a better price. At least I know that the Customer Service department for a nationally recognized company is going to work with me in the event of a problem.
 

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Yup...that was one of the two ways they pass off fakes...relabeled older version and out/out knockoff...

you got the curiosity up and I went looking...
volumes and pages and documentation out the wazoo on it...
and this PDF only seems to be the tip of the iceberg...

.
 

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Holy cow. Makes you suspicious of just about everything coming out of the big C (for China, for counterfeiting).

Think of it, you are one of several subcontractors, using primitive methods to produce your share of a known product. So you have lots of rejected parts, as do the others, so instead of scrapping them, you steal the blueprints and make your own knockoffs. Human nature is not much different in China, obviously. Probably worse in other poor countries.
 

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Holy cow. Makes you suspicious of just about everything coming out of the big C (for China, for counterfeiting).

Think of it, you are one of several subcontractors, using primitive methods to produce your share of a known product. So you have lots of rejected parts, as do the others, so instead of scrapping them, you steal the blueprints and make your own knockoffs. Human nature is not much different in China, obviously. Probably worse in other poor countries.
Throughout history, China was known for it innovations and inventions. Now, they are only know for their thievery and low quality rip-offs.

China has been stealing for years and making cheap copies. Back in the 70's I worked for W. R. Case & Sons (Case Knives). A tour group of Chinese came through; snapping pictures of all of the equipment, operations, knife patterns, etc. A few months later they started marketing cheap low quality look-a-likes. Things haven't changed four decades later.

The real upsetting thing is the unscrupulous vendors that know that they are fakes, buy them from China, and sell them to the unsuspecting public.

In Nick's case, it appears that Amazon either knew or didn't care that they were marketing a crooked vendors product. If they even braced the vendor over the issue it was apparently just a slap on the hand. The vendor disappeared and a new vendor, selling the exact same products immediately reappeared. You can't tell me that Amazon doesn't know that this is going on!

Amazon is not always the cheapest. I have found products on Amazon marketed by reputable vendors that are more expensive than buying directly from that vendors' website.
 
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As I mentioned in another thread (or perhaps it was this one) - there are three types of products: OEM - Original Equipment Manufacturer, Counterfeit, Knock-offs.
(During my law enforcement days, I regularly investigated counterfeit currency: passing and manufacture)

OEM - obvious definition - Original Equipment Manufacturer
Counterfeit - marketed to be "the original product"
Knock-off - marketed to be "just like the original"

Knock-offs aren't illegal, but counterfeits are. The problem with counterfeits is that an unsuspecting buyer thinks he's getting an original product, but is getting something that is of lesser quality, lower standards in production. In some cases, this might not be a problem - like a watch or a golf club. But in other cases it could mean a safety issue - think brake pads, medical products

Here's an article from a number of years ago - customs officials made a public display of crushing, with a steam roller, thousands of counterfeit Rolex watches as a warning to other.

7,000 fake Rolex watches crushed by steamroller - Odd News | newslite.tv
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
After some research, I bought the Scanner V from PTI...

Now that it's delivered there are other noticeable differences between the real one and the knockoffs...

1. The real one picks up a staple from about 1 1/2" away across the entire wand...
2. The rubber handle is actually rubber
3. "Garrett" is embossed in the rubber
4. The plastic housing is rugged and strong...no twisting
5. It comes with the battery
6. It comes with the right manual and warranty registration
7. The box is not plain white.,..it's a real Garrett box, pictures and all

There's probably more but these are first impressions...
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
it's never going to stop...see Stick's research in this thread...Amazon is the leading space provider for knockoff sales...the nature of the business I guess but you would think Amazon would be a little more strict...

..."follow the money"...
 
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found more

went searching and found this...


The problem originates with Amazon 3P.

Amazon’s third party marketplace

Amazon 3P, or third-party marketplace, allows merchants to setup accounts and sell items in a relatively unregulated environment. The listing shows up right next to Amazon’s 1P listings, or goods sold by Amazon, leaving little differentiation between verified listings and counterfeit goods.

Nearly 40% of paid items from Amazon are from 3P merchants

Financially, Amazon has little incentive to regulate this marketplace. For 3P sales Amazon only reports fees paid by vendors to Amazon and not the cost of goods sold, thus offering gross margins of 90 to 100% while its traditional retail business has gross margins of about 20%. On paper, this looks excellent to investors.

The problem is, more and more companies are having to place warnings on their sites alerting buyers that, while Amazon is an authorized dealer, not all sellers on Amazon are.
So Amazon doesn’t verify all of their goods sold?

Amazon has three ways that they handle fulfillment of orders:

Ships from and sold by [third-party seller]
These items are not touched by Amazon and ship directly from the Third Party Seller. This is how most of the counterfeit goods are sold.

Fulfilled by Amazon
These items are not sold by Amazon, but are shipped from one of Amazon’s fulfillment centers. This means that items are processed by Amazon but are not necessarily verified.

Sold by Amazon
These items are sold by Amazon and are most likely the legitimate product.
How does this affect their brand equity?

Amazon is faced with the same problem that eBay has struggled with for years. Unauthorized third-party sellers impersonating and undercutting popular consumer brands.

Being the largest online retailer is an impressive feat, but what if they were known as a company that sells counterfeit goods that lights people’s hair on fire or fraudulent makeup products that don’t perform as expected.

If they allow fraud to become a rampant problem, even drone delivery won’t be able to convince customers to purchase products through them.

As eBay found, this can be a very costly business. In 2008, eBay was ordered to pay $61 million to LVMH (Moët Hennessy Louis Vuitton) after it was found that 90% of Louis Vuitton bags sold on the site were fakes.

Branding expert and author of The Lean Brand, Jeremiah Gardner puts it this way;

“At the core of a brand is a relationship. In fact, relationships are the whole point of branding in the first place. It’s the relationship between an organization and an audience that creates trust, loyalty, expectation, and ultimately value in the real world. If you violate the relationship, like Netflix with the launch of Qwikster or Target with their recent credit card woes, you put the trust, loyalty, expectation, and value you have in the marketplace at risk.”

Amazon is the largest online retailer, but if they aren’t able to keep the knock-off products off their site they will be driving consumers to seek out retailers who are offering verified products without the risk of purchasing counterfeit goods.

5 Things You Should Know About Amazon’s Issues With Counterfeits

When you see a brand-name handbag or laptop being sold on Amazon for well below its retail price, it’s hard to not hit the “Buy” button. But is it a good deal or just a counterfeit in brand-name clothing?
A new report from CNBC claims that a growing number of products sold by third parties on Amazon are fakes, and that the e-tail giant is having a difficult time getting a handle on the problem.

As a result, sellers of legitimate goods say their revenues are hurting as more and more companies copy their products and offer them at steep discounts, while customers are complaining that their newly acquired items aren’t the real deal.

Here’s what we learned about Amazon’s counterfeit problem, and what the company is doing to make it right.

#1: Opening the floodgates: CNBC reports that counterfeiting on Amazon has grown significantly in recent years as the company welcomed Chinese manufacturers into its operations. Sales from China-based sellers more than doubled last year.

#2: A mixed bag of products: The increase in sales from Chinese companies on Amazon has been made possible, in part, because the company has made it easier for these manufacturers to get their products to customers quickly.

For example, Amazon registered with the Federal Maritime Commission to provide ocean freight for Chinese companies to ship goods directly to Amazon fulfillment centers, cutting out costs and inefficiencies.

#3: Commingling and false security: The increase in products from Chinese merchants has led to commingling of products at Amazon fulfillment centers.

This allows the company to put together orders with products from different sellers, making it difficult to know you’re purchasing a counterfeit item.

These orders, because they come from an Amazon fulfillment center, often contain a FBA (Fulfilled By Amazon) tag. Critics say this gives customers a false sense that their products are legitimate.

CNBC suggests that a counterfeit jacket could be sent to an Amazon facility by one merchant and actually sold by another.

#4: A lack of safeguards: Critics say that Amazon hasn’t done enough to prevent the influx of counterfeit items or prepare shoppers for the possibility that they might not be buying what they thing they are.

This is evidenced, CNBC says, in the number of sellers that offer high-end products at deep discounts. While these sales should raise a red flag for both customers and Amazon, that simply doesn’t appear to be occurring.
 
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Thanks, Stick...

If Amazon won't protect us from 3P's then we should protect ourselves from Amazon...
 
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