[hawkeye10]

I have tried to search for the answer on this forum and I am no good good at it. I have read where Stick said that you don't need to go to fine on microns because the dust build up will help with filtering. The bag I have now it now is a 2.5 micron bag and I think that is pretty good. What I would like to accomplish with a cartridge filter is to move more air or get more performance. I can't go to a bigger collector because I don't have 220 current in my shop.

1-1/2 HP Dust Collector | Grizzly Industrial

 

[Cherryville Chuck]

Don I think the only way to increase the flow through and decrease the micron size at the same time is to increase the filter area. That's why the paper filters you see are a pleated design. The pleating increases the surface area to around 300% of what a flat design would be.

 

[hawkeye10]

Don I think the only way to increase the flow through and decrease the micron size at the same time is to increase the filter area. That's why the paper filters you see are a pleated design. The pleating increases the surface area to around 300% of what a flat design would be.

Chuck I saw a Wynn filter on the internet but isn't there another company that make them for wood workers? Maybe I am wrong. I thought there was a lot of threads on this subject but I sure can't find them. Like I said I have a hard time finding stuff like that.

 

[Oakwerks]

Wynn does make filters for wood workers.... Go to their website to see...
Mine listed the brands it fit .... Pick one for your collector, and they will
include the fasteners needed for your system....

 

[Herb Stoops]

Chuck I saw a Wynn filter on the internet but isn't there another company that make them for wood workers? Maybe I am wrong. I thought there was a lot of threads on this subject but I sure can't find them. Like I said I have a hard time finding stuff like that.

I have always used Wynn filter, and most of the DC manufacturers use them too.I remember way back before cartridge filters and only bags, never heard of cartridge filters. Then Bill Pentz worked with Wynn who was making cartridge filters for big engines to make a DC filter.
Clean air standards in my life time were what actually spurred air filtration in industry.
Herb

 

[furboo]

Don, that DC looks to be the same as the Harbor Freight (HF) and the Rikon. I suspect HF, Rikon, and Grizzly all source most of the parts from the same company. There are known differences, such as HF uses a smaller impeller than Rikon. I don't know what impeller Grizzly uses. Anyway, Wynn does make filters for the HF, which should also fit the Grizzly. I went with the 35BA222NANO, but there are slightly cheaper options.

 

[hawkeye10]

Don, that DC looks to be the same as the Harbor Freight (HF) and the Rikon. I suspect HF, Rikon, and Grizzly all source most of the parts from the same company. There are known differences, such as HF uses a smaller impeller than Rikon. I don't know what impeller Grizzly uses. Anyway, Wynn does make filters for the HF, which should also fit the Grizzly. I went with the 35BA222NANO, but there are slightly cheaper options.

Rob did you get a noticeable increase in performance after installing the Wynn filter?

 

[furboo]

Rob did you get a noticeable increase in performance after installing the Wynn filter?

No change in performance, which is a good thing. And I'm generally a glass-half-empty kind of guy :wink: Because the Wynn is filtering down to a much smaller size (0.05 micron vs. HF's 5 micron bag), everything else being equal (such as filter surface area), you'd expect performance to go down. But I couldn't measure any difference. The Wynn is great and as Chuck indicated, the extra surface area of the filter is likely the reason.

The only thing I've noticed recently is that it's difficult to get the filter to sit on the collector, without any gaps. Some weather stripping might help, but I just haven't bothered, yet. There's no point in filtering to 0.05 microns if there's gaps.

 

[hawkeye10]

No change in performance, which is a good thing. And I'm generally a glass-half-empty kind of guy :wink: Because the Wynn is filtering down to a much smaller size (0.05 micron vs. HF's 5 micron bag), everything else being equal (such as filter surface area), you'd expect performance to go down. But I couldn't measure any difference. The Wynn is great and as Chuck indicated, the extra surface area of the filter is likely the reason.

The only thing I've noticed recently is that it's difficult to get the filter to sit on the collector, without any gaps. Some weather stripping might help, but I just haven't bothered, yet. There's no point in filtering to 0.05 microns if there's gaps.

I guess my thinking is way off as usual. I was thinking with more filtering surface I would get better suction. I guess not. My bag that came with the collector filters down to 2.5 microns and as I understand it the dust cake that lines the bag filters it more. I may be wrong about that to.

 

[DesertRatTom]

I remember Stick's post. He was saying that a coarser filter soon fills with a lot of sawdust and acts to allow ever smaller particles through. However, I went with the Wynn 1 micron since my lungs have zero tolerance these days for sawdust.

There more recently was a long string that included swapping out the smaller HF impeller with a Grizzly impeller, which greatly increased air flow, but took a long time to wind down. @Furbo didn't you guys spend a lot time working out air flow? I got two HF units (shop and garage), and am thinking of adding the Wynn finter to the second unit. It will be the 1 micron Wynn.

 

[Herb Stoops]

I have two stacked one on top of the other and can not even feel any air coming out of them when the DC is running.

The things I have experienced cutting air flow are :

90Deg. fittings, and "T's"
Flex duct, especially the type with ribs on the inside.
small flex,i.e. 2",2 1/2"diam.
ports smaller than the duct, requiring reducers.
any kind of fins in the ports to keep large chunks from passing
longer runs of ducts

The first Dc system I built was when they recommended the filters like an engine filter. Where the air blows from the inside out the filter was to be put into a box and the air blew into the box and then through the box to get out through the center of the filter which vented through a hole in the bottom of the box.The filer had a flange on the bottom of it that bolted to the bottom of the box. The top of the filter was capped so the air had to go through the pleats.

OK fine.
I made the box with a door on it and weather stripped tight when latched.
The first time I had to clean the filter because it was plugged up, it was a real chore. I swore, I would remedy this with the air blowing inside the filter and exhausting through the filter. Can you imagine cleaning the pleats on a vacuum cleaner filter 4' high and 16" in diam with the pleats packed with fine sawdust?
Herb

 

[Cherryville Chuck]

I guess my thinking is way off as usual. I was thinking with more filtering surface I would get better suction. I guess not. My bag that came with the collector filters down to 2.5 microns and as I understand it the dust cake that lines the bag filters it more. I may be wrong about that to.

It's true what Stick said. I ran heavy equipment for many years and that was what the equipment manufacturers would say. They suggested that when an air filter got dirty to just keep bumping it against a machine tire to loosen the excess dust until none or very little would shake free. When they got too dirty then I would wash them in a 20 liter pail of soapy water and rinse and dry them but they didn't filter as well until they got a little dirty again.

 

[furboo]

I guess my thinking is way off as usual. I was thinking with more filtering surface I would get better suction. I guess not. My bag that came with the collector filters down to 2.5 microns and as I understand it the dust cake that lines the bag filters it more. I may be wrong about that to.

I think more filtering surface area is better. That's why they Wynn (and lots of filters) use pleats.

As far as dirty = "better filtering", that's correct. But the dirtier it is, the less suction of the overall system.
Wynn discusses this pretty well at this page:

https://wynnenv.com/filter-efficiency/

To cut to the chase, see their table here:

https://wynnenv.com/wp-content/uploads/NANO-522-Data.jpg?x35957

The row across the top is the "Delta P", which is the pressure drop across the filter. The bigger this value, the dirtier the filter, and the harder your DC motor has to work to pump the same air through the system (it generally doesn't work harder, so the airflow decreases). But notice the dirtier it is, the better the "Fractional Efficiency" (the percentage of particles blocked at the specified particle size)... that is, the filtering gets better. Cool stuff.

I would still get the Wynn, because you're going to have to clean any filter, at which point you're breathing what it's not catching. But that's my lungs & budget. Although so far I've survived prostate cancer (you really don't know you've survived until you die of something else), I don't want to try my luck at lung cancer.

 

[furboo]

There more recently was a long string that included swapping out the smaller HF impeller with a Grizzly impeller, which greatly increased air flow, but took a long time to wind down. @Furbo didn't you guys spend a lot time working out air flow? I got two HF units (shop and garage), and am thinking of adding the Wynn finter to the second unit. It will be the 1 micron Wynn.

A "a lot of time" ???? You sound like my wife! :laugh2:

Yeah Tom, that's in another thread, where I compared the Wynn to the stock HF bag:

http://www.routerforums.com/tools-w...s-post1443178.html?highlight=wynn#post1443178

I put in a Rikon impeller, not Grizzly:

http://www.routerforums.com/tools-w...ollector-flow-measurements-7.html#post1474481

 

[comp56]

anything is better than a straight up bag I suppose...

 

[WoodWorkerNewbie]

anything is better than a straight up bag I suppose...

True. Bag filters aren't as efficient as cartridge collectors. Aren't they a bit messier than usual as well?

 

[DesertRatTom]

I believe the Grizzly made 1-micron canister fits the HF unit (call to confirm). It has a rotating interior brush connected to a handle on the outside. Rotate the handle and it knocks the excess sawdust off. $235 https://www.grizzly.com/products/Gr...h-Aluminum-Impeller-Polar-Bear-Series/G0548ZP

I understand it is the same size as the HF unit. If so I'd consider it. The Wynn, you slap on the sides to knock the excess off, and occasinally blow compressed air through it from the outside. The Wynn really cuts the airborne sawdust inside a shop. The bag, to me, is a no no inside the shop. Over time you will regret using it inside. And it will be too late.