[sreilly]

As I am finally getting around to the pantry build I told my wife I would do 18 years ago now that the hung door has been replaced with the pocket door I find myself designing the wall cabinets that will hang at ceiling height and will be used for those seldom/seasonal pans and such. I had thought about just doing several rectangular cabinets like the usual but then decided I wanted to do a corner cabinet as I haven't done one yet.

So a bit of time in the CAD program and I came up with what I want/need. I found a software that's designed for cabinet shop businesses but it does have a trial and an online calculator so I tried the online calculator to get a feel for sizing. I also decided that I wanted to have a clipped corner so I don't have issues if the walls aren't 100% square. I cut the plywood for the cabinet and then the 45 degree angle for the clipped corner. I was guessing that all I needed to do was cut the board that would fill that clipped corner with 45 degree cuts on both sides to fill the corner. That cut I come to see the corner piece is too thick for the boards that it connects to. So I cut about an 1/8" at 90 degrees off each side which helps but still thicker. Not to give in I set the jointer to cut the plywood in thin passes and after several passes the thickness seems to work fine.

So I found a work around and now I'd like to know what I should have done in the first place. I think they call that "the proper way". Might as well learn now before I make the real one that will hang in the pantry. These I'm making now will go in the garage as I need some in there as well but wanted to do a dry run before using the good stuff for the pantry. This Lowe's Top Choice is good enough for the garage but not for staining in the pantry. After all I did promise some time ago.

Then of course I was thinking I should have edged the plywood as the front where the door is will show the plys......before remembering I need to make the door frame (stiles and rails). Momentary lapse. Pantry will have raised panel door while the garage will just have panels in the frames. I already know how to make the frames and doors.......

Again, what should have been done to make the cabinet clipped corner properly? Curious minds want to know...

 

[Cherryville Chuck]

It sounds like you tried to butt join them and the sides were 90 and the short piece to bridge the corner had 45s. Each side should have been 22.5 degree cuts or you could have stayed with the 45s and instead of butt joining them make the bridge piece for the corner wider and overlap it on the inside of the box.

 

[Stick486]

find myself designing the wall cabinets that will hang at ceiling height and will be used for those seldom/seasonal pans and such

put a lot of those in the drawers that can be built into the base...

 

[sreilly]

It sounds like you tried to butt join them and the sides were 90 and the short piece to bridge the corner had 45s. Each side should have been 22.5 degree cuts or you could have stayed with the 45s and instead of butt joining them make the bridge piece for the corner wider and overlap it on the inside of the box.

So what magic will I need to do for the cabinet door frame? I can still cut angles on those sides as nothing has been assembled yet. I'll have to look and see what that does to the rest as the angled back and front parts have bee cut into the base and top.

 

[sreilly]

The base itself will be like a small, short workbench similar to the one in this plan from Rockler but with nicer. smaller wheels. It will be used to hold the bread maker, mixer and such. Above it will be the 3 shelf food storage unit that will be wall hung. Gotta keep busy as almost 3" of rain today keeps me in...

Should have mentioned this handy calculator https://www.pro100usa.com/calculation-/angled-cabinets

 

[Nickp]

When I run into a corner, for whatever it is (trim, crown, cabinet), my preference is to measure the angle and build accordingly. Measuring the angle will also tell you what angle to cut at the face frame for the adjoining cabinets. For example, if your walls made an 88deg corner, divide by 2 equals 46deg cuts at the front face butted to 90deg faces of the adjoining cabinets (you would use the complimentary angle - they need to add up to 180deg). Same for the inside corner if you're clipping it. Use a "long-legged angle finder" to make sure you're not building to a sloppy corner. If the rest of the wall is exactly 90, it might actually be easier to sand the hell out of the corner to match the rest of the wall and build to 90. I assume you might be running into sloppy mudding...?

Not sure what the "proper way" is...I suppose there are many.

 

[Cherryville Chuck]

So what magic will I need to do for the cabinet door frame? I can still cut angles on those sides as nothing has been assembled yet. I'll have to look and see what that does to the rest as the angled back and front parts have bee cut into the base and top.

When it comes to building cupboards Steve I'm pretty firmly rooted to the past. I prefer the look of face frames as opposed to the Euro style where the doors overlay the sides of the boxes. I normally use ply like that for the panels but I prefer to use solid wood for the face frames. That would give you a little leeway on how to join up with the sides because you can sand solid wood to fit in that situation.

If you go with frame less I would use solid wood to band the edges of all the plywood. That will hide the plies and give you a reasonably easy way to flush everything up, just a bit time consuming. But It would look really nice when finished so to me worth it. And the solid wood is more ding proof.

On the bottom of the two pictures you posted I would likely have taken the back piece and turned it 180 and put it on the inside. That makes a pretty solid joint and you can attach it with short brads though the mitered edges to the main carcass to hold it until the glue dries. I clipped the corners off my own cupboards and if I remember correctly that was how I did mine.

 

[sreilly]

Chuck I am a firm believer in using door frames and haven't made a cabinet yet without them, well the wall hung tool cabinet being the exception. My guess is that I'll need to either cut the tow panels at a 45 degree angle to give me the proper look and fit. They will be like all the others I've done and be solid wood using the rail and style bits I mentioned in an earlier post. This frame will hide all the plywood edges and match the cabinet style we have in our kitchen.

Chuck the clipped piece, I'm curious about it's orientation, looking back maybe having it on the inside would look better but I'm not seeing how it changes anything structurally. BTW, I can still do that by exchanging and flipping those two pieces as they are identical. The only thing that changes is the inside panel sides, the outside becomes the inside....I'll have to look at that but in my mind that works. But then again so did so many other things............

 

[sreilly]

So I stand corrected on that part about flipping those 2 boards for the clipped piece as they don't have 45 degree cuts, the clipped piece does. However I could still cut the angle on those 2 pieces and then remake the corner clipped part but I still don't see how structurally it would matter. Maybe look better, yes, but add strength?

 

[Nickp]

So I stand corrected on that part about flipping those 2 boards for the clipped piece as they don't have 45 degree cuts, the clipped piece does. However I could still cut the angle on those 2 pieces and then remake the corner clipped part but I still don't see how structurally it would matter. Maybe look better, yes, but add strength?

As you have it now the glue is butt to butt...on the inside the glue will be butt to face...also, if you put in any screws or nails, they will go across the plywood grain rather than into it. Just thinkin' out loud...

 

[sreilly]

As you have it now the glue is butt to butt...on the inside the glue will be butt to face...also, if you put in any screws or nails, they will go across the plywood grain rather than into it. Just thinkin' out loud...

I understand the thought but keep in mind this piece will have no load bearing at all. It simply fills in the open spot and is basically for looks, to fill that gap. It wont have any interaction with the wall but the two sides that it attaches to will. Maybe I'm missing something here. I do appreciate the thoughts as that's the reason I did these first, to work out any kinks before I do the actual pantry cabinets. I have though I may change things up a bit and actually have a 3/4" offset to the back/top/sides to allow for cleats fro hanging to more evenly distribute the weight keeping n mind the walls have been done for 18 years and no provision has been made for hanging cabinets. Of course I can cut into the sheet rock and add supports but that would be messy and unnecessary I think. Cleats help more evenly distribute the weight and our use of these won't be for heavy items as they will be higher up. The heavy stuff will be on the rolling cart below.

 

[Cherryville Chuck]

Exactly what Nick said. The back will look ugly but if it will never be seen again then that isn't important. If it might be seen again as in a china cabinet or corner style grandfather clock then you would want to bevel the sides to match the center piece. As for looks on the inside it will look as good or better. They way you were going there was the possibility of showing a crack if the piece didn't fit precisely to the sides (that would also make for a weak joint). With my way you just have a joint line. Since it overlays the sides there is no possibility of having a crack. Plus you have more glue surface. I use brads to join them but like Nick said there other methods like finishing nails, screws dowels, etc. Brads are just quick, easy, and one handed.

It seems to me I may have had to add shims behind the toe kicks to get those to fit properly on the corner boxes.

 

[Nickp]

I understand the thought but keep in mind this piece will have no load bearing at all. It simply fills in the open spot and is basically for looks, to fill that gap. It wont have any interaction with the wall but the two sides that it attaches to will. Maybe I'm missing something here. I do appreciate the thoughts as that's the reason I did these first, to work out any kinks before I do the actual pantry cabinets. I have though I may change things up a bit and actually have a 3/4" offset to the back/top/sides to allow for cleats fro hanging to more evenly distribute the weight keeping n mind the walls have been done for 18 years and no provision has been made for hanging cabinets. Of course I can cut into the sheet rock and add supports but that would be messy and unnecessary I think. Cleats help more evenly distribute the weight and our use of these won't be for heavy items as they will be higher up. The heavy stuff will be on the rolling cart below.

Steve, keep in mind that when the corner is not clipped it adds strength to the cabinet and helps prevent it from racking...even when handling it for installation. When you clip the corner and do not reinforce it to its full strength you could experience some racking. If you clip it and leave it as you have it now, make sure the top and bottom make up for the loss of corner strength.

If I understand what you have described, you essentially have two 1/2 cabinets held by the top and bottom without a good corner. Just a precaution...

 

[Biagio]

Steve, I have only done this with melamine-faced particle-board, which is the standard for kitchen cabinet carcasses over here. To me the clipped corner is a bit like Love Story - never having to say you're sorry. I unashamedly copied a commercial unit, as those guys had already sorted out the issues for ease of production.
1. The oblique filler piece was much wider than yours. If one butts the two back pieces at 90 degrees, that additional space is largely wasted - a lot of users cannot comfortably reach into the corner - I can't. I imagine that there is a carousel in the cabinet, and think of clearing the carousel with the filler piece - the rest is wasted space to me.
2. The filler piece was bevelled at 45 degrees along each long edge. Easier to do than beveling the larger end pieces. Placed as Charles said, on the inside, with the bevels facing to the back. If the end pieces are at a true 90 degree orientation to each other, two clean joint lines, no need to worry about the length of the hypotenuse compared to the thickness of the panels. In your case, you will be able to glue the bevels to the plywood faces - not possible with melamine.
3. The thing to pay attention to, is that the filler piece needs to extend the thickness of the top and bottom at the back - that way it can be fixed to those components, adding to rigidity and antiracking. One can attach a small triangular piece to close off the bottom of the cabinet into the corner - the top is less critical, unless you will be placing small stuff on the top - been there.
4. In my case, the vertical components were fixed to the top and bottom by dowels for alignment, and knock-down fittings to pull everything together - not fine furniture standards, I know, but 20 years later, not a smidgen of movement.

I don't know how you will make or attach the frame - in my case, it did not matter on some of the cabinets, because they had complementary doors or bi-fold doors. Some others were even cruder, but because of the Euro-style overlapping doors, it was not a glaring faux-pas. The door will have to open to about 160 degrees, if you will be using Euro hinges, otherwise access is restricted.

 

[tomp913]

Steve, I have only done this with melamine-faced particle-board, which is the standard for kitchen cabinet carcasses over here. To me the clipped corner is a bit like Love Story - never having to say you're sorry. I unashamedly copied a commercial unit, as those guys had already sorted out the issues for ease of production.
1. The oblique filler piece was much wider than yours. If one butts the two back pieces at 90 degrees, that additional space is largely wasted - a lot of users cannot comfortably reach into the corner - I can't. I imagine that there is a carousel in the cabinet, and think of clearing the carousel with the filler piece - the rest is wasted space to me.
2. The filler piece was bevelled at 45 degrees along each long edge. Easier to do than beveling the larger end pieces. Placed as Charles said, on the inside, with the bevels facing to the back. If the end pieces are at a true 90 degree orientation to each other, two clean joint lines, no need to worry about the length of the hypotenuse compared to the thickness of the panels. In your case, you will be able to glue the bevels to the plywood faces - not possible with melamine.
3. The thing to pay attention to, is that the filler piece needs to extend the thickness of the top and bottom at the back - that way it can be fixed to those components, adding to rigidity and antiracking. One can attach a small triangular piece to close off the bottom of the cabinet into the corner - the top is less critical, unless you will be placing small stuff on the top - been there.
4. In my case, the vertical components were fixed to the top and bottom by dowels for alignment, and knock-down fittings to pull everything together - not fine furniture standards, I know, but 20 years later, not a smidgen of movement.

I don't know how you will make or attach the frame - in my case, it did not matter on some of the cabinets, because they had complementary doors or bi-fold doors. Some others were even cruder, but because of the Euro-style overlapping doors, it was not a glaring faux-pas. The door will have to open to about 160 degrees, if you will be using Euro hinges, otherwise access is restricted.

I have made several corner cabinets using this construction which gives a nice solid and clean joint in the back corner.

For the face frame design cabinet, the cabinet is made as shown in the photo posted by sreilly, with the outer edges of the end panels cut square (@ 90 degrees) and the back vertical edges of the face frame are cut at 45 degrees so that they fit tight to the side panels. Because the hypotenuse of the face frame material (using 3/4" wood and plywood) is longer than the thickness of the plywood, the result is a small triangular projection past the end face of the plywood. Careful work with a plane will remove this projection flush with the end panel, with the added benefit that the "exposed" corner of the cabinet is all wood, with no fragile plywood seam to get damaged. Because of the simplified construction, the cabinet is attached to the walls by screws through the corner strip shown as well as the projection of the side panels past the top and bottom of the cabinet.

The attached photos show a cabinet using this face frame construction, although the photo really doesn't show much (and I was a little lax taking in-process photos on this project). As it was just a shop cabinet, I also simplified the construction (a lot actually) as the OSB walls acted as the inner walls and let me cut down on material. The cabinet is made from Sande plywood purchased from Home Depot, the face frame and edging are made from poplar.

 

[Biagio]

@tomp913
Tom, I thought of what you describe so clearly for the face frame, although I could not articulate it as well as you have. But in my mind, I encountered a problem if there were to be flanking cabinets on either side of the corner cabinet, each with a face frame. Am I correct in thinking that if all the cabinets' side panels were the same measurement front-edge to back, the styles of the frame of the corner cabinet would land up being recessed in relation to the styles of the adjacent cabinets?
The front vertical edges of the cabinets would align, but the thickness of the styles at the contiguous edges would differ considerably. It might require thicker face frame members, or deeper side panels for the corner cupboard, in order to avoid a step in the face frames. The thicker styles might then need a different approach to removing the protruding edge than hand planing, in my clumsy hands, anyway. For that reason, I might have the side panels larger on the corner cabinet, but wuld have to do a drawing to calcuate the difference.

 

[tomp913]

@Biagio You are correct, the width of the side panels will have to be adjusted if there will be "standard" cabinets butted up to them as you would have in a normal kitchen application. It's not that hard to calculate the required panel width - and it may be just as easy to mock-up a joint and get the actual dimension needed - but I have to agree that the tolerances would need to be pretty tight so that you don't get a step there at the joint. I've never actually done this, the cabinets I've done have been free-standing, but I think if I had to do it then I would make the corner cabinet depth a little light and then just shim it out at installation so that the edges were 12" off the wall to match the face frames of the adjoining cabinets.

Been a while since I installed a kitchen with a diagonal wall, but I recall it being a little fussy getting the corner cabinet in, not only plumb and vertical, but so that the corners lined up with the rest of the run - not my most favorite job. Given that, installing a cabinet built like this probably shouldn't be too much different.

Another option, and I was having a hard time visualizing it until I found this video https://www.google.com/search?q=installing+a+diagonal+wall+cabinet&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS874US874&oq=installing+a+diagonal+wall+cabinet&aqs=chrome..69i57j0.9648j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#kpvalbx=_vgtPX7KbJc2k_Qb__JaYBw29 would be to make the corner cabinet deeper than the adjoining cabinets - the corner cabinet in this video I believe is 15" and it actually looks OK with the standard 12" cabinet butted up to it - and the advantage is that you don't need to add the filler panel as they did.