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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Im new here and to the world of routing so I need some help on this one. I searched and found some related 60 degree forum threads, but not exactly what I needed.

First off, is there any way I can get a 60 or at the least a 45 degree chamfer bit that is reversed or upside down oriented like a dovetail bit V instead of the most common chamfer ^ style?

I need this because my surface that needs to be scratch free would have to be laid down on the table with my normal chamfer 45 degree bit and I cant do that. I would be scratching the hell out of my delicate surface trying to bevel the edges. So I need the chamfer bit to be reversed like a dovetail bit. Does this exist? If not, do they have a 60 degree angle dovetail bit that could work and do pretty much the same beveling edge look?

So here's exactly what I need. Im cutting 1/8" plastic so my bit doesn't have to be extremely big. I would need it with a guide bearing and the shank is 1/4".

Any help you can give will be greatly appreciated.


p.s. I was at the store the other day and the guy said I can build my own bit piece by piece. Is this true and could I do this for a 60 degree with bearing chamfer bit? Price more expensive?

Thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Why not protect the face with plastic or even 1/4" MDF and route as you normally would. If this is clear plastic you could possible scratch the back side and see it through the front.
That's a good idea. What would be the best plastic option for that? Something thin, sticks well, protects, and easily peals off. Are there thin sticker like protective sheets that I can buy?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I know absolutely nothing about your project, but the first thing that I noticed is that the difference between 60 deg. and 45 deg. across one-eighth of an inch is miniscule, but maybe this goes into a mitered joint, or something like that. 60 deg. is just 30 deg. flipped-over edgewise for SOME THINGS.

By the way, If I were doing this: I would cut two boards of sufficient dimension and at the required angle, and file or sand-off the edge. the amount you're removing is not much bigger than the finger of an ant. You would sandwich-clamp the two boards with the plastic positioned to only stick-out less than one-eighth of an inch! Then use the "sandwich as a "shooting board".

Good Luck, Be Safe and Have Fun Doing This!
I am making guitar pickguards. This angle is crucial since its vintage spec accurate. The difference from a 45 to 60 on a pick guard is quite drastic. For the 45 degree you dont see much of a small outline of the material, but for a 60 degree you have a nice thicker line. This small difference goes a long way. Heres what Im doing.



It almost seems the smaller I go the more of a difference 60 degrees makes.

Anyone have any links to a plastic wrap or plastic film that would work?

What is this one being used?


 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Alright I got my answer. Its called a Amana Bevel Rail Cutter. I just bought one. These are the rarest bits and I picked one up at a steal for $35. Now I can see exactly what Im doing and keep the face and surface of my soft smooth plastic material nice and clean. I couldn't find these online or anywhere else in the world. Thank God the guy down the road actually had one. Wow, thats a blessing from the Lord. Here's what it looks like for that future someone coming along with my same question.


 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
You may not need it now, but this is for future reference. OfficeMax or OfficeDepot sell a roll of plastic lamination used in a manual lamination tool they also sell. The material has a sticky side and a smooth side. I have not used this for anything but laminating. I do not know if the sticky side would leave any residue after removal.
Is it the thick stuff used for laminating paper and memos? If so that would be way to thick. If you have ever bought a new pickguard they always come with a very thin protective layer that easily peels off. This is exactly what I'm looking for.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Ah that's alright. I'm happy with it, plus having in hand right away was worth it. I guess these aren't the rarest bits, I just didn't know what they called them. An invested 60 degree chamfer bit is very rare and that's what I thought it was when I bought it. It pretty much is, just with a different name. It's good to know they are still out there though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Ah that's alright. I'm happy with it, plus having in hand right away was worth it. I guess these aren't the rarest bits, I just didn't know what they called them. An invested 60 degree chamfer bit is very rare and that's what I thought it was when I bought it. It pretty much is, just with a different name. It's good to know they are still out there though.
"Inverted 60 degree"* sorry phone auto correct.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Hey guys, its been a long time since we last talked about this, but I need your help again. So last time I needed the blade part to be inverted and sticking out and above the router table, but now I need a bit that has a 60 degree edge with bearing that sits down into the router table and here is the hard part... I need it to be no more than 1 1/4" wide to fit into my table hole. I can't keep switching out the table insert so I just need to find this bit.

I found this bit here that would work perfectly, but the bearing doesn't extend all the way out to the blade since its made to have the top and bottom lip. I even thought about getting a wider bearing for this bit, but its more than the standard 1/2" bearing size.


Any suggestions? Shank size is not a major deal, but I would prefer 1/4", but will take a 1/2" to get this bit and save my fingers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
Awesome, thank you for that.

I think I might have found the mate to my other router bit on page 1. I just learned this tonight that what I have is a part to a set called Stile and Rail bits. I am sure you guys knew that already. Its the bevel set that actually doesn't seem to exist anymore or at least Amana doesn't make them anymore and I can't find them from any other company. I just bought this one which is a 33 degree Stile bevel bit. I had the rail 33 degree bit on page one, but as you can see that is almost a death trap for your fingers the way the big is sticking out and so close to my fingers while cutting. So now my only concern is if this new Stile bit will fit through the hole in my router table enough of the blade to cut my material without chewing up the surrounding hole material. The hole in the table is 1 3/16" diameter. The total diameter for the bit is 1 5/16". Super close and I am hoping enough of the blade will show through since its a 33 degree angle. What do you guys think? Oh, I am only cutting material that is just under 1/8" thick.

 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
find a stacked rail and stile set you like... use just the cutters you need...
look to chamfer bits... 30° cutters are to be had...
cut your material flat and you have a 30° chamfer..
cut the material on edge and you'll get a 60°cut...
a bearing set/kit will rescue the day when you least expect it..
Great info there, thank you, but if you can find what you are talking about in stock please let me know. I have tried every company that I can find on google and all of them are out of stock or discontinued. To recap with my last order, they actually told me they don't have that be either and cannot get it so they refunded me. So back to a needle in a haystack chase. I might have to get one custom made at $200 or so.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Mark did you ever find the sheet plastic you were looking for? I have found that regular old Glad Cling Wrap which has adhesive on one side works well for my veneering, should work for your plastic. It doesn't leave a residue on wood when peeled off.

Herb
Hey Herb, thanks for remembering. I did find what I needed and figured out a different way so now I don't even need the sheeting anymore. So this thread is now ONLY about finding that 33º Chamfer with bearing bit.

To the rest of you guys, Amana discontinued their bit that I listed above and FSTools has one, but they don't have them made and its going to be a month or so before they are ready for distributors. Carbide.com also carries them in limited stock and are currently out. They get theirs custom made from Israel and that is still a few months away as well. I never knew what I was doing would be so rare and uncommon. All the help you guys can give to track down this bit, I sure appreciate it. None on Amazon, ebay, or all of google from what I have seen.

Yes, there are 60º bits that are a little more common, but usually they are huge in diameter about 1-1/2" to 2" and that will definitely not fit through my 1-3/8" router table hole.

You say, then get a larger router hole insert. I do have one, but I cut very tiny pieces all day for my job and my material would fall through the larger hole and not have enough surface to cut flat if I go any larger, so I need the hole smaller at the size of 1-3/16". I also use a bearing insert at this same size too. I am trying to make things all efficient so that I don't have to change out the table insert 100 times a day stripping my surface screws and wearing things out.

I have also thought about getting a full new table and router setup for this very purpose to use the larger 60º bit, but I am still trying to see if the $30 plan is still possible instead of the $600 plan with full new setup.

So what am I looking for that doesn't seem to exist?

-33º chamfer measured horizontally.
-Diameter no more than 1-3/16" +or- a hair
-With bearing at the tip
-1/4" shank preferably, but can use 1/2"

This is what it looks like (#49440) and what I am looking for that is extremely rare:



In regards to this blue bit from Rockler, that could work well, except I do not know how wide the bearing would need to be. The shank is 1/2" so a 1/2" bearing would be too small and still leave a lip on my material. I need that bearing to come right to the edge for a perfect chamfer bevel cut. I wouldn't be using the straight bit area, only the chamfer angled part. Question is, is there enough angled blade to cut 1/8" of material?


Thanks for the help guys.
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Mark, add an auxiliary table top to your router table. 1/2" MDF would be one choice for this. Make whatever size clearance hole you need for your bit and install the bit above your 1-3/16" opening in your table. (Provided your router has the reach and that your collet will fit through the standard PC opening)

If this wont work you could install a mounting plate with removable center rings like the $13 Grizzly T10432047.
Hey Mike, thats a possibility because I like how the insert in the pic has two rings opposed to my one ring. This is my exact table.




See how there is only the one black ring. If I had a setup like yours I could remove the inner 1-3/16" ring leaving a larger opening allowing my 60º larger chamfer bit to work well and not shred the plastic insert. The only problem is that I am still cutting small pieces and it MUST be perfectly flat especially when doing a bevel and since the hole is so big and the pieces are small this could cause slight bending of my template leaving uneven bevel cuts and gouges. You know?
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
I take it you realize that 33° is a very odd angle...
if you use a 30° chamfer and face cut you get a 30° edge...
if you edge cut 30° you get a 60° face chamfer..

is this what you want???
look to CMT...
Industrial router bits-V-Tongue & groove router bit set-CMT tools

here's Freud...
Freud Tools

I will only be doing face cuts, so I need to be doing a 60 degree face cut ending up with a 60 degree edge.

Edge cutting is not an option.

When I say 33 degree, yeah I know that is a odd angle and 30 degree can work. Also, when talking about 30 degrees I am referring to a horizontal measurement like Amana uses for some of their bits for some reason.

So 60 degree vertical bit and 30 degree horizontal bit is what I need, BUT no wider in diameter than 1-3/16" +or- a hair.

What does this look like? "chamfer plane w/ an adjustable guide is another posibility... "
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 · (Edited)
@Spitfire7...
why is you can't do edge cuts???....
any decent rabbet plane w a guide will work...
make an angle block for it and chamfer away...
if you can use a plane you can edge cut/route...
find a bit that's close and make a sloped table to set what degree you are after...
up grade your table and do away w/ all of the handicaps...


First off forgive me, because I am so new to routing that I don't know these terms and in my ignorance I am thinking that you might not know exactly what I am trying to do. Here is exactly what I am doing. Watch the clip at exactly 10 min and 30sec. He is using a 45 degree chamfer bit to create a nice beveled edge on the pickguard, but I am trying to use a 60 degree measured vertically or a 30 degree measure horizontally.

Here is what the finished product will look like after using a 60 degree bit.



Let me know if that makes sense
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
all the sense in the world..

have a bit made...
use what is available..
have a ready made bit modified to work w/ what you have...
upgrade/modify your equipment to accommodate...
build or buy a serious router table...
Yeah I might have to go that rout of getting a bit made. I do have a decent table that works great, but might need a second for a permanent 60 degree bit setup. So this thread now comes down to two things.

1. Does this bit exist (Hoping someone knows of it or has one)

2. Who would you recommend for making unique custom bits?
 
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