Information needed on batteries

3605 Views 34 Replies 21 Participants Last post by George G, 10 mo ago

mgmine

Discussion Starter · May 28, 2022

I'm about to bite the bullet and spend $109 on a DeWalt 18 volt battery. However I see that I can get a new 20 volt impact driver , two new batteries and a charger for $99.00. The drawback is that the batteries are only 1.3 amp hr. Has anyone used the 1.3 amp hr batteries and if so what is the downside.

DEWALT ATOMIC 20-Volt MAX Cordless Brushless Compact 1/4 in. Impact Driver, (2) 20-Volt 1.3Ah Batteries, Charger & Bag DCF809C2 (homedepot.com)
Another option is the Ridgid 18volt with one 2 amp hr battery for the same price BUT the battery and tool are guaranteed for life.
RIDGID 18V Cordless 1/4 in. Impact Driver Kit with 2.0 Ah Battery and Charger R86002K (homedepot.com)

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Marco

· #2 · May 29, 2022 (Edited)

Throw off brand replacement batteries in the mix. I bought a pair in 2019 and are very good. Because of the limited life of the battery and its cost, batteries and any cordless tool will no longer be purchased by me. I've gone "Corded".

If I were in the cordless tool market I would have to go with Ridgid because of their warranty.

Reactions: 1

DesertRatTom

· #3 · May 29, 2022

I tried the 20v battery and adapter. The larger size batter, the same deal you're considering. I must say I hate it. The battery has failed already. The adapter gets stuck in the tool and is extremely difficult to get off. I haven't tried them yet, but there are 18v offbrand batteries for DeWalt on Amazon I'll try when my current ones peter out. I always bought 2 at a time so each one was less, but I don't see that anymore. I have several dead batteries and I'm thinking of taking them to a battery shop to see if they can replace the cells.

Reactions: 1

tooler2

· #4 · May 29, 2022

I have found that the smaller batteries are useless on high demand tools like impact gun but fine for 1/4'' hex driver, flash light etc. I suspect the voltage drops under use because there is only a single series of cells rather than several strings in parallel on the bigger batteries.

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TenGees

· #5 · May 29, 2022

I wanted to get a couple of extra batteries for a Bosch drill. When on sale it was about $10 more for a drill, case, charger and 2 batteries as it was for 2 batteries (same rating). That was an easy choice. 1.5 Ah is about the smallest batteries these days. Lower Ah is ok if you have 2 batteries and the tool doesn't draw that much.

Biagio

· #6 · May 29, 2022

Hi @mgmine,
I assume your 18V battery is Ni-Cad? In that case you may want to stump up for a new brushless tool and Li-ion battteries. They are labeled 20V as a marketing gimmick in North America - elsewhere in the world, they are still 18V.
The Li-ion batteries are a darn sight better, both in longevity, duration of use on a single charge (esp when coupled with a brushless-motor tool) and weight.
I triied what Tom did - I am a Dewalt Drill bigot, as I find the 3-speed gearbox matches my needs best, so after repacking and replacing Ni-cads several times in a 10-year period, I went Li-ion, but also purchased the adaptor - I could not bear to throw out my trusty 18V drill, which had performed “beyond the call of duty”. Same problems as Tom mentioned, plus the drill was slowly discharging the battery while not in use (I suppose some leakage in the speed control, or across a worn commutator, even with new brushes). Should not have been sentimental (I still have the old drill) - the adaptor was surprisingly expensive, and I almost never use it.
The two technologies are not directly interchangeable, and all the newer Dewalt stuff (I also have the circular saw and jigsaw) is Li-ion). I suppose the the smaller batteries have their uses, but I agree with tooler2 - you can use a larger battery for smaller jobs, not the other way round.

‘I am intrigued by the the Ridgid warranty - does that mean that they have a swop-out programme for batteries for the next 20 years? What does lifetime mean? (the HD site is off-limits outside of N. America).

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mgmine

Discussion Starter · #7 · May 29, 2022

My first thought was to get some aftermarket ones off of Amazon. I was very disappointed in them and returned them yesterday. I did a video on YouTube showing why they weren't suitable. My concern is that the 1.5 amp batteries will not have enough umph when it comes to larger bits Biago mentioned. I had also considered getting a 18 to 20 volt adapter to go from the Rigidi battery to the Dewalt but that combination doesn't seem to exist.

JIMMIEM

· #8 · May 29, 2022

mgmine said:
My first thought was to get some aftermarket ones off of Amazon. I was very disappointed in them and returned them yesterday. I did a video on YouTube showing why they weren't suitable. My concern is that the 1.5 amp batteries will not have enough umph when it comes to larger bits Biago mentioned. I had also considered getting a 18 to 20 volt adapter to go from the Rigidi battery to the Dewalt but that combination doesn't seem to exist.

If those are NiCads why don't you just rebuild them? The rebuild batteries are/were about half the price of a whole new battery.

Chris Itin

· #9 · May 29, 2022

DesertRatTom said:
I tried the 20v battery and adapter. The larger size batter, the same deal you're considering. I must say I hate it. The battery has failed already. The adapter gets stuck in the tool and is extremely difficult to get off. I haven't tried them yet, but there are 18v offbrand batteries for DeWalt on Amazon I'll try when my current ones peter out. I always bought 2 at a time so each one was less, but I don't see that anymore. I have several dead batteries and I'm thinking of taking them to a battery shop to see if they can replace the cells.

I bought these https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0822STVDR/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and have been pretty satisfied with them. I thought about getting the adapter, but saw that Dewalt has discontinued it, so I figured it was a bust. When these die, I guess I will bite the bullet and get a new brushless "20v" drill and batteries and charger. 18v drill and circular saw and batteries and charger will be useless. Geeeeeezzzzzuuuuuussss, that hurts.

Reactions: 1

DesertRatTom

· #10 · May 29, 2022

Chris Itin said:
I bought these https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0822STVDR/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and have been pretty satisfied with them. I thought about getting the adapter, but saw that Dewalt has discontinued it, so I figured it was a bust. When these die, I guess I will bite the bullet and get a new brushless "20v" drill and batteries and charger. 18v drill and circular saw and batteries and charger will be useless. Geeeeeezzzzzuuuuuussss, that hurts.

You only have to remember that Stanley owns DeWalt to know why they screwed all of us 18v tools. I love my jig, circular and reciprocating DeWalt tools and their drills are exquisite. So If I have to replace them it won't be with DeWalt. Why would we do business with a company that does this to us?

mgmine

Discussion Starter · #11 · May 30, 2022

JIMMIEM said:
If those are NiCads why don't you just rebuild them? The rebuild batteries are/were about half the price of a whole new battery.

I've thought about rebuilding myself, there is a lot of information on Youtube, but in the end if they are not as good as originals then I've thrown more good money away. I'm glad I was able to return the ones I bought at Amazon.

Biagio

· #12 · May 30, 2022

Hi @mgmine,
one advantage of a rebuild is that you can use Ni-Mh instead of No-I-Cad cells - you get some extra amp-hourage out of them. I certainly did. But you will still get the limited life of that technology - the memory effect.

I see the Li-ion to Nicad adaptors on Amazon are all OEM, now, darn site cheaper than the DeWalt original. One of the effects is to alter the balance of the drill significantly.

Like Tom, I considered ditching DeWalt (who in the South African market, price themselves above Bosch, Metabo, Makita, Hitachi), and going with Metabo. Their tools are significantly quieter than the rest, and the older and deafer I get, the less tolerant of noise I become. Also, in Europe, major manufacturers have standardized on the batteries: Metabo, MAFELL, Lamello, I think even Festool are part of the Cordless Alliance System (CAS), incorporating some 20 different brands and over 300 individual machines - one battery will fit them all. They have taken the battery size up to 10 amp-hours now.

I still like DeWalt drills the best, and am impressed by (but cannot afford) the DeWalt Flexvolt batteries. I live in hope that the US brands would join CAS, but I imagine your famous rugged individualism will get in the way of a good idea. Even Bosch, who have this sense of exceptionalism, have gotten into an alliance with other European brands, eg Fein, and it is only a matter of time before they agree on the benefits of standardization, where batteries are concerned. The cells are all made by a handful of makers, so there is no strategic differentiation possible. As Lithium becomes scarce and more expensive, if ways are not found to reduce the cost of the batteries, sales growth of the tools will be inhibited.

With the next technology change-over, if I am still in the game, I will ditch DeWalt if they have not joined.

BTW, still thinking about that Ridgid lifetime warranty. As every Apple phone tells you, the battery is a consumable, with a limited lifespan (about 300 charge cycles on Ni-cad), so how are they going to not exclude that from the warranty? They have a loophole for “normal wear and tear”. Buyer beware.

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jw2170

· #13 · May 31, 2022

Topical subject at the moment.

My Dust Buster battery has died, and I am about to disemble it to see what I can do before I buy a new one....

woodie26

· #14 · 12 mo ago

I have Two DeWalt 20 V Drill and a Jig saw, I love them!

Rebelwork Woodworking

· #15 · 12 mo ago

I bought two 12v batteries to replace my Dewalts from Amazon... Still working and holding charge ror months..

spzwood

· #16 · 12 mo ago

Biagio said:
Hi @mgmine,
I assume your 18V battery is Ni-Cad? In that case you may want to stump up for a new brushless tool and Li-ion battteries. They are labeled 20V as a marketing gimmick in North America - elsewhere in the world, they are still 18V.
The Li-ion batteries are a darn sight better, both in longevity, duration of use on a single charge (esp when coupled with a brushless-motor tool) and weight.
I triied what Tom did - I am a Dewalt Drill bigot, as I find the 3-speed gearbox matches my needs best, so after repacking and replacing Ni-cads several times in a 10-year period, I went Li-ion, but also purchased the adaptor - I could not bear to throw out my trusty 18V drill, which had performed “beyond the call of duty”. Same problems as Tom mentioned, plus the drill was slowly discharging the battery while not in use (I suppose some leakage in the speed control, or across a worn commutator, even with new brushes). Should not have been sentimental (I still have the old drill) - the adaptor was surprisingly expensive, and I almost never use it.
The two technologies are not directly interchangeable, and all the newer Dewalt stuff (I also have the circular saw and jigsaw) is Li-ion). I suppose the the smaller batteries have their uses, but I agree with tooler2 - you can use a larger battery for smaller jobs, not the other way round.

‘I am intrigued by the the Ridgid warranty - does that mean that they have a swop-out programme for batteries for the next 20 years? What does lifetime mean? (the HD site is off-limits outside of N. America).

Registration with Ridgid is a pain and if you need a warranty part down the road good luck. If it is from a previous generation they'll tell you it's just no longer available. You may have a 20 year old corded tool that still works, but you really shouldn't plan on keeping any battery tools more than 5 or 6 years unless the industry starts caring about backwards compatibility. If you're a professional go battery. If you use your tool 5 times a year stick with a cord. IMHO.

GregLittleWoodworks

· #17 · 12 mo ago

I always stick with the manufacturers batteries. The cost more but always seem to last and have proven quality. It is worth the extra money to me. I do not own any Dewalt cordless tools but have many Makita cordless tools and batteries that have always been extremely dependable and long lasting.

Reactions: 1

JohnM77

· #18 · 12 mo ago

mgmine said:
I'm about to bite the bullet and spend $109 on a DeWalt 18 volt battery. However I see that I can get a new 20 volt impact driver , two new batteries and a charger for $99.00. The drawback is that the batteries are only 1.3 amp hr. Has anyone used the 1.3 amp hr batteries and if so what is the downside.

DEWALT ATOMIC 20-Volt MAX Cordless Brushless Compact 1/4 in. Impact Driver, (2) 20-Volt 1.3Ah Batteries, Charger & Bag DCF809C2 (homedepot.com)
Another option is the Ridgid 18volt with one 2 amp hr battery for the same price BUT the battery and tool are guaranteed for life.
RIDGID 18V Cordless 1/4 in. Impact Driver Kit with 2.0 Ah Battery and Charger R86002K (homedepot.com)

I used the DeWalt 18 volt system for many years. I had about ten+ different tools using the 18 volt battery. The three things I didn't like about the system we’re 1) the batteries always seemed to be dead when I grabbed them for a quick project, 2) there was no way of knowing the charge level in the battery so I always had to charge them before taking them offsite and 3) the batteries got expensive. Every Christmas Lowe's would put them on sale at two for $79. That stopped.

I finally decided to upgrade to DeWalt's 20 volt system. I picked DeWalt's system primarily because I could get an adapter to continue using my legacy 18 volt tools. I replaced the tools that I frequently use with 20 volt brushless tools, but used the adapter for the less used tools. The 20 volt system fixed all of the issues I had with the 18 volt system. If I didn’t have the legacy DeWalt tools, I was seriously leaning towards the Ridgid system, primarily because of their guarantee.

Now for my recommendations. If you are a casual user and you don't need a lot of cordless tools, the Ridgid brand gets decent reviews. They do make different Ridgid lines, so be careful when you are comparing. If you do go with Ridgid, be sure you register the tool/batteries. If not, no lifetime warranty.

If you want to stick with DeWalt, not all of the DeWalt batteries have a “fuel gauge”, three little lights that tell you how much charge. Get ones with the fuel gauge. I don’t think the ones you are looking at have the fuel gauge. I have a two without the gauge and they sit on the shelf. As far as battery capacity goes, as someone else mentioned, reviewers say that higher capacity batteries provide better torque and better overall performance. My preference is to reduce weight so I use the smallest battery I can get away with.

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RiovistaAndy

· #19 · 12 mo ago

Marco said:
Throw off brand replacement batteries in the mix. I bought a pair in 2019 and are very good. Because of the limited life of the battery and its cost, batteries and any cordless tool will no longer be purchased by me. I've gone "Corded".

If I were in the cordless tool market I would have to go with Ridgid because of their warranty.

I have only 2 cordless tools. A drill and a driver. All the rest of my powered tools are corded. They're lighter and more powerful than battery powered ones.
But also most of my work is with hand tools. Brace and Bits, planes and chisels.

Reactions: 1

old55

· #20 · 12 mo ago

Welcome to the forum @spzwood

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