[Stissot]

Does anyone know anything about X-Edge and this Matrix Mat stuff? I saw the video on youtube and talked to the company and they say it helps with vacuum and holding parts. I have an AXYZ router that I got used and the vacuum doesn't hold anything well. We cut interior and exterior letters for signs out of Aluminum, Acrylic, and PVC and we have trashed so many parts trying to make this thing work. Does anyone have experience with this product or something else that works besides holding them down with a stick? This company has other tools and stuff I want to try but I'm not sure about it because everyone says you should use Onsrud or Belin tools.
We are just getting started with all of this so any help would be great.
thanks,

Steve Tissot
Tissot Signs

youtube.com/watch?v=lg7HzWJQBZY
xedgetools.com/x-edge-store/MatriX-Mat-Underlay-p104110147

 

[difalkner]

Welcome to the forum, Steve! I have not seen that product but it looks pretty cool on their video. I'd want to see some independent testimonials, though.

David

 

[Cherryville Chuck]

Hi Steve and welcome. The video looked promising. I have a router mat that Lee Valley sells and it does a pretty good job against slippage but it's meant to throw on a bench and do handheld work on. It does increase friction quite a bit and that's probably what the Matrix Mat does too except it's probably porous.

I know the Onsrud tooling is first class. Plus the customer service department is top of the line. We had an active member from there until he got too busy to participate and he knew his stuff about CNCs and I was told by another member or two that there were others in the CS dept who were just as knowledgeable. I haven't heard of these guys before so you may have to try them to find out.

 

[Stissot]

Thanks, David and Chuck for your fast reply and info. I was hoping to get some testimonials here and not ones that the manufacturer will spoon feed me. I'm really new to all of this and so I called X-Edge Tools to get some info and their customer service seemed to me to be very knowledgeable about CNC routing. The guy said he was an ex-operator on an AXYZ machine so he knew the machine very well. I have a big job coming up with PVC letters and they have a tool they say made to cut PVC the best. This job has small parts that I NEED to hold so I am thinking about getting some of this mat and this Razer tool to try it all out. I'll give everyone my feedback when I get it done.

 

[MEBCWD]

Welcome to the Router Forums Steve.

Looks good in the video. It is a decent size mat and probably easily trimmed to any size you want. At the price, about $3.25 per square foot, I would think it would be worth a try. Of course I would check to make sure you don't have a leak in the system and also clean the surface to make sure you aren't just bypassing a problem.

 

[UglySign]

I have an AXYZ router that I got used and the vacuum doesn't hold anything well. We cut interior and exterior letters for signs out of Aluminum, Acrylic, and PVC and we have trashed so many parts trying to make this thing work..... but I'm not sure about it because everyone says you should use Onsrud ....

Steve, hang on to your money and get a hold of AXYZ and see what they could do
for you about your vac system. Need some more detail about your machine setup.
What kind of top, spoilboard material, vac system, does it have leaks. Maybe have
someone come in and look things over if you're trashing stuff.


We're using Onsrud 63-600 series for Alum & 63-700 for acrylic faces.
CNC Router Bits, Onsrud Cutter, CNC Router Tooling - CNCRouterBitsXP.com

The Mat does seem cool .... actually thats what I need for special projects.... Cool.

 

[4DThinker]

If your bed is MDF, and you installed a new piece, then one reason the the vac may not be working well is that MDF has a skin that is compressed and hard to draw through. We have a Multicam CNC and when installing a new MDF bed we skim both the top and bottom off before trusting it to hold down parts. Once both sides are skimmed off we have no trouble holding down parts with the vacuum pump.

4D

 

[Stissot]

Ronnie and 4D, Thanks for the input, we had the guy who owned the machine before us train us on how to run and use the router and he said it's how it's always been. He also tought me the MDF trick of milling both sides and he said if I want more vacuum to use LDF instead of MDF so we bought that and have it on the machine now. I think the one 10hp becker pump is not enough for a 5X10 table but I'm making it work because of the $$ for a second pump like I have seen other companies do.
But thanks for thinking of ideas, I need people who have been down this road to help me.

Steve,

 

[4DThinker]

Another trick we use is to throw scrap sheets of plywood on the area around the part being cut to help concentrate the vacuum hold on it.

4D

 

[UglySign]

Another trick we use is to throw scrap sheets of plywood on the area around the part being cut to help concentrate the vacuum hold on it. 4D

Hey 4, what do you think of a rubber sheet, the thickness of a bicycle tire tube.
Throw that on the exposed areas. The trick of the scrap panels sometimes are too
big, too small or just outright awkward. At least arubber mat would get most of it.
No? Im going to order one for my new SS if I ever get it hooked up.


Definitely LDF, Trupan, Ultralight and what other names they call it.
Nasty stuff with no DC



Steve are you cutting small parts? Using Bridges... ooops... Tabs?
Leaving a thin skin maybe? Once cut thru you're breaking the seal.


5x10 is a good size. Goldilocks

 

[4DThinker]

Hey 4, what do you think of a rubber sheet, the thickness of a bicycle tire tube.
Throw that on the exposed areas. The trick of the scrap panels sometimes are too
big, too small or just outright awkward. At least arubber mat would get most of it.
No? Im going to order one for my new SS if I ever get it hooked up.


Definitely LDF, Trupan, Ultralight and what other names they call it.
Nasty stuff with no DC

I've never used rubber sheet/mat but I can't see why it wouldn't work. The only way you'll find out is to try it.

4D

 

[Stissot]

Hey, Guys sorry for the delay I am trying to get jobs out the door. Ok for the update.

I talked to this guy Jay at X-edge who was super knowledgeable about cutting and he knew the AXYZ systems very well. Long story short I bought the Matrix Mat and 3 of their Razer tools that Jay said would cut Sentra well. I was amazed at how much better the parts held and with just this thin mat under the sheets. I got 3 pieces to cover my 5 x 10 table and I got the Job done without having to babysit the machine and scrap a bunch of the parts. The only Negative on the mats is I did beat it up a little because my tool length or z-axis is not that accurate so I'm not sure the lifespan of it and blowing off the table is harder with this mat on my spoil board but that is an easy workaround with some tacks on the edge.

The Razer tools worked great too but I should have only bought 1 it did the whole job. So I have 2 extra for future projects. It's a weird 3 flute tool with these notches in the sides but the edge finish was way better and no melt back like the Onsrud O-Flute cutter I was using.

I don't want to sound like a commercial for these guys but I was impressed by their knowledge and willingness to help.

Thanks for the input,

Steve

 

[Cherryville Chuck]

The notched edge bits are called chip breakers and are made and sold by a number of makers. Thanks for the update Steve.

 

[Stissot]

Chuck, thanks for the terminology lession! I have seen these in other tools but not a 3 flute tool that looks like this. I can tell you it cut expanded PVC like butter.

xedgetools.com/x-edge-store/Razor-Series-PVC-UHMW-etc-c18767029

thanks
Steve