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Hi and welcome.

1. Could you add one or more photos with the doors/drawers slightly open? It is difficult to make out which is door and which is frame. Your tape measure obscures some detail on the drawers.
2. Could you indicate on the photo what exactly you want to reproduce?
3. If possible, could you measure the depth of the groove? It looks a bit deep for the usual cock-beading.
4. Are you planning to make the doors with Cope-and stick, or some other method to hold the panel?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hi and welcome.

1. Could you add one or more photos with the doors/drawers slightly open? It is difficult to make out which is door and which is frame. Your tape measure obscures some detail on the drawers.
2. Could you indicate on the photo what exactly you want to reproduce?
3. If possible, could you measure the depth of the groove? It looks a bit deep for the usual cock-beading.
4. Are you planning to make the doors with Cope-and stick, or some other method to hold the panel?
Thank you for the quick reply!

The groove is 1/8” deep. It’s a repair job, the cabinet doors are no longer made from Lowe’s. It’s a typical shaker frame with this convex edge profile.
Here’s more pictures of a different frame.
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Those commercial doors were not made on a router.

Here is a sheet of different styles of bits and the profiles they make. But if you're making doors, you need to get a match set of door making bits. Some of these bits will work for the rails and stiles, but door panels are easier to do with a bit set for doors. Every maker has them. I use Sommerfeld Tools matching bit sets. https://www.fabricdirect.com/shop/c...le-46-unbleached-muslin-fabric-100-yard-roll/ You might also want to watch Marc Sommerfeld's videos on youtube on making panel doors. Really good technique, clear and detailed.

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Here is a very simple Shaker style set. Matched sets are best because once you set the first bit, the other or rest are exactly the same shaft length, so you don't have to reset by trial and error. It works by placing a half inch rubber grommet into the bottom of the collet so the shank bottoms out on that grommet. Grommet, not o-ring.

Where it gets more complicated is if you want a raised panel inside the door frame. That requires an additional bit or two, depending on the profile.

The doors you are showing, have been made from glued up strips of solid wood. That gives you the thickness you need to carry the profile from the frame out onto the panel.
 

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As Tom said.
If you have a close look, the groove on either side of the convex moulding is asymmetric. There are bits (see below - not shown in Tom’s sheet) which will produce a groove, but with symmetrical roundovers on either side of the groove. You have a round over on one side and a crisp edge on the other - had to be done by gluing pieces together, or with a highly customized bit on a shaper. Also, the raised panel edging is a continuation of one crisp edge, does not appear to have been made with both bits of the rail-and-style bits Tom shows (the corners are mitred, not cope-and-stick).
Looks like at best, you will be able to approximate the moulding with a router, not duplicate it.
At a pinch, you could try a diy custom scratch stock for the grooves. They are deeper than what I have managed - but then I am no expert at scratchstocks.

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Interesting how the grain pattern at the mitre corner in your last photo makes the inner part of the moulding look raised.
 

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Apologies, I am being stupid, let me offer a simple alternative before the more experienced members call me out.
Once I convinced myself that the inner part of the moulding is flat, not raised, the answer presented itself.

You will have to do the bullnose before you mitre the pieces. Available in different radii, there should be one to match yours.

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
As Tom said.
If you have a close look, the groove on either side of the convex moulding is asymmetric. There are bits (see below - not shown in Tom’s sheet) which will produce a groove, but with symmetrical roundovers on either side of the groove. You have a round over on one side and a crisp edge on the other - had to be done by gluing pieces together, or with a highly customized bit on a shaper. Also, the raised panel edging is a continuation of one crisp edge, does not appear to have been made with both bits of the rail-and-style bits Tom shows (the corners are mitred, not cope-and-stick).
Looks like at best, you will be able to approximate the moulding with a router, not duplicate it.
At a pinch, you could try a diy custom scratch stock for the grooves. They are deeper than what I have managed - but then I am no expert at scratchstocks.

View attachment 403616 View attachment 403617


Interesting how the grain pattern at the mitre corner in your last photo makes the inner part of the moulding look raised.
Apologies, I am being stupid, let me offer a simple alternative before the more experienced members call me out.
Once I convinced myself that the inner part of the moulding is flat, not raised, the answer presented itself.

You will have to do the bullnose before you mitre the pieces. Available in different radii, there should be one to match yours.

View attachment 403618
It looks like the bullnose or fingernail bit is closer to the shape I need. What’s the difference between those two bits? Sorry, to change the discussion; I’m not familiar with them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
When comparing the bullnose and fingernail bits to my cabinet shape; the convex shape of the half round is closer to the fingernail bit. The bullnose looks more “proud” once it’s cut into the material from the videos I’ve been watching. I have not seen videos on the fingernail bits; any suggestions are appreciated.

I would definitely shape the edge of the material first before routing the shaker style styles and rails.
 

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The bullnose bit will cut both grooves at the same time as shape the bullnose.. the fingernail bit will not cut crisp grooves, and not as deep. The grooves will be too wide to look good.
Go to Leevalley.com and look up bullnose bit amongst router bits. You will not be using it in the usual way, on the edge of a board, as shown in Tom’s sheet. You will be using it in a router table, protruding up from the table. I will attempt a sketch.
Best to get a 1/2” shaft bit.
 

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Hey Jafo9, sorry about the delay. It is easier to show you than to make a sketch.
My bullnose bit was from Rockler, I think. You will notice that the grooves are much wider than your originals. It may not matter if you do a batch of doors that are all the same, but one door in a set will stand out some. Other brands may be closer to what you want, otherwise you may be able to get a sharpening service to grind top and bottom edges down.
The groove to bullnose ratio may also vary by size of bit. I only have one size, cannot remember the radius.
Thinking about it, you will probably only get what you want in 1/4” shank (like mine), which means multiple passes in order not to stress the bit. I did the sample (soft yellow pine) in two passes, you may need more. I did not quite get the height of the first groove right, yours looks like 7 mm, but you get the idea.

Set the fence flush with the maximum curvature of the bit, mark the front or back of the fence on your table, then move the fence further forward and sneak up to the mark on successive passes.

Sorry about the mess in the photo showing the profile of the resultant bullnose - the best light (gathering storm) was on my wife’s pottery and potting table.

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I am having a little trouble responding to this because you've posted two completely different types of doors. And the solution for the first (white) is different that the types in the second set of sample doors.

The second set of door pictures are fairly common profiles and you might be able to find a match by looking through some catalogs, either online or in print catalogs. I don't think a bull nose will do what you want.

CMT, Sommerfeld, and a bunch of other companies you'll find online can send you catalogs of bits. There are thousands of different bits, and you might after searching, find one that matches.

However, bit sets are not cheap, and if you can't find a match, you might consider replacing all the doors with commercial or shop made doors. And you might also consider going to a cabinet shop in your area with the door you want to match. and seeing what they can do for you.

But I don't think it's going to be easy reproducing that profile with a router bit.

One last possibility to consider is to have someone, or yourself, make a hand plane iron to the profile, and hand plane enough stock to make a replacement door.

Short of good luck, and a thorough search, or even reproducing the profile to scale and sending copies to all the bit makers, I don't think there is an easy fix. Even if you matched the profile, you still have to match the finish, easier to say than do.

If I had that dilemma, knowing my wife would hound me constantly about the odd door, I'd replace the doors, all of them and be done with it. If you take that route, your bit set will set you back, but you'll also have to buy a fair amount of wood, which you'd have to plane flat and to thickness because big box material is never straight and flat enough to glue up properly, and or use ply for flat panels.

You'll also need jigs to the modern hinges, and forstner bits to drill to mount them. Another expense.

Not meaning to discourage you, but duplicating and matching the other doors is very likely to fail and you'll have a sore thumb door to live with for many years. Here's a site to price cabinet doors by size. Hampton Bay Custom Unfinished Cabinet Door - The Home Depot
 

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Left something out. If you decide to build or match with unfinished commercial doors, then you still have to finish them to go with the other woods in the existing cabinet carcasses. This will almost certainly require having enough extra material to try weveral kinds of stains and finishes on to get the match. I think that would be easier to do if you have a cabinet shop make the doors. They will need a sample to match the finish. You have to at least mach the face frames.

Are you sure you can't salvage the existing problem door? Maybe post a picture of that door we can look at to suggest options?.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Hey Jafo9, sorry about the delay. It is easier to show you than to make a sketch.
My bullnose bit was from Rockler, I think. You will notice that the grooves are much wider than your originals. It may not matter if you do a batch of doors that are all the same, but one door in a set will stand out some. Other brands may be closer to what you want, otherwise you may be able to get a sharpening service to grind top and bottom edges down.
The groove to bullnose ratio may also vary by size of bit. I only have one size, cannot remember the radius.
Thinking about it, you will probably only get what you want in 1/4” shank (like mine), which means multiple passes in order not to stress the bit. I did the sample (soft yellow pine) in two passes, you may need more. I did not quite get the height of the first groove right, yours looks like 7 mm, but you get the idea.

Set the fence flush with the maximum curvature of the bit, mark the front or back of the fence on your table, then move the fence further forward and sneak up to the mark on successive passes.

Sorry about the mess in the photo showing the profile of the resultant bullnose - the best light (gathering storm) was on my wife’s pottery and potting table.

View attachment 403644 View attachment 403642 View attachment 403643
Thank you for the awesome example! The only difference I see is the groves are wider than what I have. I guess I’ll have to keep searching for a bit that has smaller grooves. Maybe I can have a custom bit made to match?
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Left something out. If you decide to build or match with unfinished commercial doors, then you still have to finish them to go with the other woods in the existing cabinet carcasses. This will almost certainly require having enough extra material to try weveral kinds of stains and finishes on to get the match. I think that would be easier to do if you have a cabinet shop make the doors. They will need a sample to match the finish. You have to at least mach the face frames.

Are you sure you can't salvage the existing problem door? Maybe post a picture of that door we can look at to suggest options?.
I plan on making the doors frames myself to match. The doors are painted white with charcoal glaze in the groves. If they were going to be in different rooms, I wouldn’t mind using a different profile bit. Unfortunately, the broken cabinet is really close and I have to match it or make all new doors…
 

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@Jafo9,
as Tom says, there are many manufacturers, and you may find the ideal bit. You will need to establish the radius of the bullnose - perhaps you can cut a cross-section from the broken door to show the profile?
My bit cut a deeper groove than yours - 3/16”. A shallower groove would, I guess, permit “thinner” cutting edges on either side of the bullnose.
I dare say you could have a bit modified or custom-made - you guys are blessed with choices in lumber and tooling that the rest of us only dream about. But I also think a custom-made bit could be a bit pricy. Modification would need some skills, as there are small cutting edges at the top and bottom of the bit.
I can’t tell from the photos whether the panel side of the frame is a 90 degree edge, or whether there is a slight bevel.

Please keep us posted as to how you get on.
 
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