Should I go cordless? - Page 7 - Router Forums
 58Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #61 of 66 (permalink) Old 06-29-2019, 02:56 PM
Moderation Team
 
Cherryville Chuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Country: Canada
First Name: Charles
Posts: 14,522
 
Default

Square drive is gaining popularity in the US but is competing against Torx. Here in Canada where Robertson hailed from it's a different story. Many small hardware stores and the Home Hardware chain sell them bulk in bins like nails. My local store sells them for $3.99 a pound in zinc (gold coloured) coated and they are nice and sharp, unlike the Spar pack types which need a starter hole to drive easily. Ceramic coated ACQ compatible deck screws are $5.99/lb. McFeely's is one place you can order them from down there. https://www.mcfeelys.com/square_drive_screw Once you use them you will want to throw away all the Phillips drive ones you have. The square drive is such a positive engagement that it is quite easy to snap the heads off when screwing into hard woods like white oak or hard maple so care needs to be taken and starter holes drilled and countersinks should also be considered.

I've recently started using GRK screws for some projects and I really like them and they use a T-15 torx driver. They have better weather resistance and I think they are also compatible with ACQ treated lumber. HD carries them: https://www.homedepot.com/b/Hardware...5yc1vZc255Z8ta They have a self drilling tip so they drive really easy, but they are also more expensive that Robertson's are up here.

Robertson and Phillips (the phillips head drive inventor) both worked for Henry Ford. Up to the time Robertson invented his drive type in 1908 there were only slotted types. Henry wanted Robertson to hand over the patent and Robertson told him to pound sand. Then Phillips invented his drive and he did turn the patent over to Henry. The Phillips drive was actually better for the auto industry as you can't over tighten them like you can a square drive. The head will strip first as you pointed out. I believe that Henry was able to keep Robertson's screws from being sold in the US until fairly recently. I asked a hardware store owner who was in his 60s back in Portland in about '74 for them and he just gave me a puzzled look and they had been around for over 60 years at the time.
Navyblue likes this.

Someone I consider a master woodworker once told me that a master woodworker is not someone who never makes mistakes. He is someone who is able to cover them up so that no one can tell.
Cherryville Chuck is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #62 of 66 (permalink) Old 06-29-2019, 09:52 PM
Forum Contributor
 
DesertRatTom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Country: United States
First Name: Tom
Posts: 14,374
 
Default

Once I bought the first 18v Dewalt and some spare batteries, I started buying the "naked" tools without extra batteries.

I would have gone with Bosch because every one of their tools I do have is superb, accurate, holds adjustment, has more than sufficient power. 1617s, Compound Sliding Miter, ROS, lots of bits, blades and lots of accessories that are all top notch, and easy to find replacement and parts, customer service that's outstanding.

I am not dissatisfied in any way with the DeWalt 18v system, and at least they have provided a 20v upgrade path, which is a nice thing. I just recently found DeWalt batteries on sale, two for $99, so I'm fully committed for another several years, since I'm 76, someone is likely to inherit them because they'll outlast me. The DeWalt drills also have torque adjustments (I have two).

I found a paint covered 18 v DeWalt battery laying in the street I live on. Works great and is fairly new. So I'm really charged up.
JFPNCM and Navyblue like this.

The more I do, the less I accomplish.
DesertRatTom is offline  
post #63 of 66 (permalink) Old 06-30-2019, 01:40 AM
Registered User
 
JOAT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Country: United States
First Name: Theo
Posts: 5,706
 
Default

Made the decision. Going cordless. only under special conditions. One of my on-going projects will use a one cylinder engine. Not about to yank a pull cord anymore to start it, and not about to lay out that much cash for an electric start. Instead will go the K.I.S.S. route. Going to get a HF battery powered drill, with a 18V lithium battery, they're listed for about $25. I'll use a socket with it and use that to crank the engine. Not to the stage where I will need it yet, and that is the only cordless batter powered tool I'm planning on getting. Thought you had me converted, didn't ya? Hehehe

"It ain't what you're told, it's what you know." - Granny Weatherwax
I am currently unsupervised. I know, it freaks me out too. But the possibilities are endless!
Call me a craftsman, artisan, or artistic, and I will accept that. Call me an artist and you will likely get a quite rude comment in return. I am not a @#$%ing artist.
JOAT is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #64 of 66 (permalink) Old 07-01-2019, 08:01 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Country: South Africa
First Name: Biagio
Posts: 194
 
Send a message via Skype™ to Biagio
Default

@Cherryville Chuck ,
What is your take on the common self-threading screws nowadays, compared to the older tapered slot-head wood screws? When they first became common some thirty years ago, I remember a lot of old hands in the British woodwork mags muttering darkly about them not working in hard timbers, snapping off, not holding, etc. but either the screws have improved, or the predictions were too Cassandra-like.
I still drill pilot holes and counter sinks, but do not miss drilling the clearance for the shaft of the screw.
+1 for square drive, vs Philips or Pozi.

Last edited by Biagio; 07-01-2019 at 08:02 AM. Reason: Typo
Biagio is offline  
post #65 of 66 (permalink) Old 07-01-2019, 08:22 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2011
Country: United States
First Name: Jim
Posts: 10
 
Default

The square drive has been popular in FL with deck screws for many years and Torx is starting to take over it.
I hate slot head wood screws and throw every one of them I cross in the trash!
I will take the Torx over the square and the square over the phillips (which I really don't care much for anymore)
They are fine going in but how do they come out years down the road exposed to weather, the torx seems to be best and lucky if you get a phillips out.
st8yd is offline  
post #66 of 66 (permalink) Old 07-01-2019, 11:16 AM
Moderation Team
 
Cherryville Chuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Country: Canada
First Name: Charles
Posts: 14,522
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Biagio View Post
@Cherryville Chuck ,
What is your take on the common self-threading screws nowadays, compared to the older tapered slot-head wood screws? When they first became common some thirty years ago, I remember a lot of old hands in the British woodwork mags muttering darkly about them not working in hard timbers, snapping off, not holding, etc. but either the screws have improved, or the predictions were too Cassandra-like.
I still drill pilot holes and counter sinks, but do not miss drilling the clearance for the shaft of the screw.
+1 for square drive, vs Philips or Pozi.
I like the self drilling type screws but the hardest thing I've driven them into that I can remember is some 30 year old D fir floor joists and they went into those like butter. If I were using long screws and going into something really hard like maple or white oak I think I would still drill a pilot. A self drilling point is not the same as a pilot hole and often, especially in hard woods, a screw driven into a pilot hole may hold better because only the threads are cutting into the wood where without it the screw may be resisting going down and is damaging the fiber from the action of trying to force the point down deeper. You see the same action when you start many screws. They will start to bite but then rip out the the few threads they've cut until you get a little deeper and there is enough friction with the sides of the hole to keep it forcing down.

Along the same lines of thought, Lee Valley sells kits (drill bit and tap) for drilling and threading wood with machine screws as opposed to wood screws. I've done this a few times in particular when replacing small brass screws on the escutcheons of antique furniture. Their trials have shown that machine threads in threaded holes hold at least as well as threads cut by a wood screw. My experiences say that's correct. I've never had a machine screw pull back out yet in 20 years or so that I've been doing that.

Someone else mentioned removing old screws. I've probably done a few thousand square drives that in some cases were so rusty that the shaft was about to rust through. I haven't used any torx for that long so I can't speak for how well they'll come out later. If they've been painted over or if the heads are really rusty then you may need to take a pick and clean out the socket first but most are removable. I've also used square drives to make threads for the crappy Phillips head screws that come with things like bathroom towel holders so that you can sink them without stripping them on the way in. I've used the same screw to make a dozen holes and they are often still okay even after being driven and removed that many times, something that is impossible with even a really good quality Phillips like a drywall screw for example.

Someone I consider a master woodworker once told me that a master woodworker is not someone who never makes mistakes. He is someone who is able to cover them up so that no one can tell.
Cherryville Chuck is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Router Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cordless routers for round overs MGildersleeve General Routing 13 01-25-2018 07:22 AM
Cordless Drill Recommendation CanuckGal Tools and Woodworking 57 08-10-2009 08:59 PM
RIGID 1/2" Cordless Drill Noddy Tool Reviews 8 10-05-2007 03:27 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome