Used A Block Instead Of A Fence - Router Forums
 
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 10:30 PM Thread Starter
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Default Used A Block Instead Of A Fence

Some time back it was pointed out to me the danger of trapping a workpiece between the fence and the blade on my TS. Further more it was suggested that a short fence be afixed to the primary fence sos that when cross cutting the piece between the blade and the fence would not be trapped once the piece being cut cleared the short fence leaving space between the workpiece and fence and thus not be trapped. Pretty simple stuff for anybody familiar with such things but for a new comer it is something that due to ignorance might be a safety hazard and I was one of those that could have gotten hurt. Fortunately for me I was lucky and did not get hurt before being warned about the potential danger.

As members of the this forum know about me from reading my threads and posts, I do have a tendency to reinvent the wheel and I know that it drives some of you nuts, but I guess that is just the way that I am wired. Anyway I had an idea. Here is what I did.

I used piece of 2x2 scrap material and cut it to exactly 3.000" according to my dial caliper. With this done I would set the scale on the Incra LS fence positioner three inches longer than what I wanted a cross cut to be. Then I would place one end of the three inch block of 2x2 against the fence and one end of the piece that I would be cross cutting against the other end of the block. The miter gauge that was set at 90 degrees was then placed in the miter slot left of the blade to support the workpiece being cut. All I was doing of course is using the block of 2x2 instead of a short fence to position the workpiece away from the primary fence, very simple and it works great as well as being safe.

Kind of a long winded way of explaining something so simple but the idea was one of my good ones and I just wanted to pass it on to anybody that has not yet dealt with the issue of the danger of trapping a piece of wood being cross cut between the blade and the fence.

Jerry
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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 10:50 PM
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Don't worry about re-inventing the wheel Jerry. If someone didn't occasionally re-invent wheels we would still have wooden spokes on our automobile tires.

Dragons slain. Damsels rescued. No reasonable request refused ... unless the dragon's really big.

Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. ~ Leonardo da Vinci

You can't use up creativity. The more you use, the more you have. ~Oscar Wilde

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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 06:18 AM
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Hi Jerry,

If I can add my two cents here. I have many years of experience working with a TS having taught Industrial Arts to High school students. Your caution using what amounts to be a stop block while cross cutting is certainly very appropriate. Your three inch block gives adequate clearance between the saw blade and the rip fence while cross cutting and this set-up will allow accurate repeat cuts ( I am assuming that is your objective).

However, there still remains a possible risk which will always be in play when you mix the fence and the miter gauge in cutting stock to length. The very best solution IMHO is to use a dedicated sliding cut-off box. There are some nice commercial models or these can easily be accurately built. This solution simply means that the rip fence plays no part in the cross cutting process. The stock is supported on both sides of the cut and a stop block can easily be deployed for repeat cuts. In so many ways this set-up can easily be much more accurate than using a miter guage.

But even better than this solution is a dedicated cross cut "station" am I believe is an essential part of the effecient shop. I am referring to the use of a power-miter box which there are many different models on the market. Clearly these tools are specifically designed for cross cutting. Most people do not realize that a TS Primary Function is to cut stock along the grain (ripping is its forte) and not its length. Hope this is helpful! JPF
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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 07:33 AM
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John is probably right about the miter saw/miter box being the ideal solution but if, like me, you're tight on space then it may not be an option. In my shop (garage) experience with one of these comes in real handy.



I toyed with making a sled but instead I am waiting on a piece of 80/20 extruded aluminum (1030 profile) to make an Osborne style extendable aux. fence for my miter gauge. Then I'll be able to use the extrusion tracks to mount an adjustable stop block there for repeated cuts.

Just another option to think about.

GCG
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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 08:23 AM
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Jerry, your solution is appropriate, however; for narrow boards (in my case less than 12") the best solution is as John (JPF) stated: The sliding [compound] miter saw beats anything else. We often find ourselves needing to crosscut wider pieces - which is where the table saw gets employed and as stated above with a well-made sled for crosscutting you cannot go wrong. You may choose to purchase some tablesaw fence clamps - mine came from Rockler and they are easily exchanged among differing elements within your shop, they are quite inexpensive and extremely effective.
Your thinking on this is very good and again, my hat is on the floor - impressed with your extreme accuracy in woodworking.
Take care dude and your wife's back surgery is still in my prayers - Otis Guillebeau from Auburn, Georgia

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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 12:44 PM
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Jerry-
Good job. Tell me how this affects your continued pursuit of accuracy.

Guys-
Many threads ago, we discussed that this would be better done on a miter saw, or sled. He knows that. He has an Incra Express. He has an Incra V27 miter gauge. He has an Incra LS-TS rip fence system.

Accuracy on angles is not his present primary concern. "He is practicing crosscuts on his table saw"- cutting across scrap crown moulding to very short lengths. The emphasis of that practice is that he is learning and practicing different aspects of his tooling. That emphasis is currently is on learning to use his table saw accurately. His primary concern is 90 degree cuts to accurately consistent lengths on that tool. He previously was using his miter gauge and rip fence and trapping the piece between the fence and blade. This method is "safer" than what he was doing.

I applaud his experimentation and practice, his continued interest and tenacity. There's over a hundred ways to do the same thing. It may only be open to you if you are exposed to some of those ways, then if you have practiced some of those ways... It's then a skill added there in your toolbox... ready for if it ever needs to be used. Just like him wanting to learn a skill to do mortise and tenon joints... to do a project. He's adding and building those skillsets... Adding those tools to his toolbox.

"Don't worry, I saw this work in a cartoon once."
"Usually learning skills and tooling involves a progression of logical steps."

Last edited by MAFoElffen; 01-07-2013 at 12:50 PM.
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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 03:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAFoElffen View Post
Jerry-
Good job. Tell me how this affects your continued pursuit of accuracy.

Guys-
Many threads ago, we discussed that this would be better done on a miter saw, or sled. He knows that. He has an Incra Express. He has an Incra V27 miter gauge. He has an Incra LS-TS rip fence system.

Accuracy on angles is not his present primary concern. "He is practicing crosscuts on his table saw"- cutting across scrap crown moulding to very short lengths. The emphasis of that practice is that he is learning and practicing different aspects of his tooling. That emphasis is currently is on learning to use his table saw accurately. His primary concern is 90 degree cuts to accurately consistent lengths on that tool. He previously was using his miter gauge and rip fence and trapping the piece between the fence and blade. This method is "safer" than what he was doing.

I applaud his experimentation and practice, his continued interest and tenacity. There's over a hundred ways to do the same thing. It may only be open to you if you are exposed to some of those ways, then if you have practiced some of those ways... It's then a skill added there in your toolbox... ready for if it ever needs to be used. Just like him wanting to learn a skill to do mortise and tenon joints... to do a project. He's adding and building those skillsets... Adding those tools to his toolbox.
Then there's noobs like me, who have no real extra shop time to experiment and are learning in every step of every project. Through his practice and pursuit of perfection, Jerry keeps coming up with questions i haven't even figured out that i need to ask. So...i get the benefit of the education without spending as much time and material.

I'll confess that i can't always follow by just reading, and often i'll head out to the shop just to walk through some of what i've read--kind of like learning rhythms by playing air guitar. Anyway, thanks for the questions and for the answers!!
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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 05:10 PM
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I think the important part Jerry is that you have a firm grasp of the principles needed to safely do that job. It is often necessary to adapt something you know to fit specific situations and sometimes it is good to alter a method to a way that you are comfortable working with.

Someone I consider a master woodworker once told me that a master woodworker is not someone who never makes mistakes. He is someone who is able to cover them up so that no one can tell.
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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 06:04 PM Thread Starter
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In regard to the posts to this thread so far, I did not mention that I do have and I do use my Incra Express Sled for most of my cross cuts on narrow workpieces. I just wanted to experiment with the block to see how it would work after being warned about the issue of trapping a workpiece between the blade and the fence.

In regard to accuracy and repeatability. Yesterday evening did get out to the shop and wanted to see how a new router bit will cut when I need it. In my case this requires moving the base of the Incra LS fence positioning system down past the blade on the TS to the router table that resides to the left of the saw. After doing some cutting with the new bit I returned the base to the position that it needs to be in when using the TS. I then cut a attempted to cut a three inch piece of stock using the block in mention in this thread.aa The piece measured 2.995". This will give you some idea of the accuracy of both the Incraik3Z System and the block idea. I like it.

Jerry

Last edited by Jerry Bowen; 01-07-2013 at 06:11 PM.
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