Glue Question - Router Forums
 17Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 10:15 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
berry's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Country: United States
First Name: Berry
Posts: 300
 
Default Glue Question

I've been asked by a brother-in-law to make 'garden arbor' for his outside model railroad. The outdoor layout is in the White Mountains of Arizona. So sun, some rain and snow. I'm working from plans from a model railroading magazine, he provided.

I'm using cedar. The trellis pieces are 1/8" x 1/8" x 1 1/2" long. The legs are 1/4" x 1/4" x 4".

What kind of glue would you use? TB III or would some CA glue be better? or???

Thanks for reading and considering my question.

May the grain be ever in your favor.
berry is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 10:22 AM
Registered User
 
DonkeyHody's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Country: United States
First Name: Andy
Posts: 901
 
Default

I would use Titebond III. I think it's plenty weatherproof enough for this application.
berry likes this.

“We should be careful to get out of an experience only the wisdom that is in it and stop there lest we be like the cat that sits down on a hot stove lid. She will never sit down on a hot stove lid again and that is well but also she will never sit down on a cold one anymore.” - Mark Twain
DonkeyHody is offline  
post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 10:42 AM
Moderation Team
 
Cherryville Chuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Country: Canada
First Name: Charles
Posts: 15,084
 
Default

Bolts and nuts as much as possible, screws where those aren't practical. I've tried resourcinol and used PL400 which are both waterproof and the wood failed beside the joint in fairly short order. I have a pair of wooden benches which are twice as old as anything else I've done that were bolted together with galvanized bolts and the slats screwed down and then the counter bored screw holes plugged with tapered wooden plugs and they are badly weathered but still as solid as the day I built them. I covered the uprights on the benches with 1 x 6s which were blind doweled from the underside using dowel centers to locate the holes and those were glued on (don't remember with what anymore) and they quit holding and one board blew off. Water soaked right through the board and destroyed the bond.

BobJ3 used to say the say thing, mechanical fasteners instead of glue.
Ray Newman likes this.

Someone I consider a master woodworker once told me that a master woodworker is not someone who never makes mistakes. He is someone who is able to cover them up so that no one can tell.
Cherryville Chuck is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 10:45 AM
Forum Contributor
 
Stick486's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Country: United States
First Name: Stick
Posts: 25,287
 
Default

I would use non-water based glues such as a polyurethane glue and treating the wood as troublesome wood is a plus...

PL Premium would work better than most anything out there...
use sparingly as it expands as it cures.. mechanical fastening and/or clamps are a must...
mineral spirits/turpentine clean up while it's wet...
Loctite PL Premium Polyurethane Construction Adhesive from Loctite Adhesives
Attached Files
File Type: pdf GLUEING TROUBLESOME WOODS.pdf (66.5 KB, 93 views)
Ray Newman likes this.

This would have been the week that I'd have finished chewing thru the restraints...
If only new layers hadn't been added....

Stick....
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"SNORK Mountain Congressional Library and Taxidermy”
Stick486 is online now  
post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 12:17 PM
Registered User
 
Bodger96's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Country: Canada
First Name: Bob
Posts: 195
 
Default

I know epoxy is more $ but I have never had a problem with any outdoor project coming apart.

Regards Bob
Bodger96 is offline  
post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 12:29 PM
Forum Contributor
 
Gaffboat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: United States
First Name: Oliver
Posts: 2,090
 
Default

Ummm, guys? All your advice is good but did you miss the size he's working with? The legs are 1/4" x 1/4" x 4" and the trellis pieces are 1/8" x 1/8" x 1 1/2". At best he might be able to use #4 screws but I think for the miniature size of what's being built Titebond III will do just fine. If he's really concerned, some two-part epoxy would work well also.
berry, vchiarelli and PhilBa like this.

Dragons slain. Damsels rescued. No reasonable request refused ... unless the dragon's really big.

Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. ~ Leonardo da Vinci

You can't use up creativity. The more you use, the more you have. ~Oscar Wilde

http://profhenrys.blogspot.com

Last edited by Gaffboat; 04-01-2016 at 12:50 PM.
Gaffboat is offline  
post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 12:50 PM
Forum Contributor
 
Stick486's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Country: United States
First Name: Stick
Posts: 25,287
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaffboat View Post
Ummm, guys? Your all your advice is good but did you miss the size he's working with? The legs are 1/4" x 1/4" x 4" and the trellis pieces are 1/8" x 1/8" x 1 1/2". At best he might be able to use #4 screws but I think for the miniature size of what's being built Titebond III will do just fine. If he's really concerned, some two-part epoxy would work well also.
duh...

at that small of pieces WRC or any cedar won't do well...
the wood it's self will quickly break down...
might want to pick another wood...

Black locust and dogwood would be excellent choices for AZ...
think hundred year old fence posts...

more choices...
African Ebony
Bald cypress (old growth)¹
Catalpa
Cherry, black
Chestnut
Cypress, Arizona
Junipers
Locust, black³
Mulberry, red³
Oak, bur
Oak, chestnut
Oak, Gambel
Oak, Oregon white
Oak, post
Oak, white
Osage-orange³
Redwood
Sassafras
Walnut, black
Yew, Pacific

¹The southern and eastern pines and bald cypress are now largely second-growth, with a large proportion of sapwood. Consequently, it is no longer practicable to obtain substantial quantities of heartwood lumber in these species for general building purposes.
³These woods have exceptionally high decay resistance.
berry likes this.

This would have been the week that I'd have finished chewing thru the restraints...
If only new layers hadn't been added....

Stick....
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"SNORK Mountain Congressional Library and Taxidermy”

Last edited by Stick486; 04-01-2016 at 01:54 PM.
Stick486 is online now  
post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 02:31 PM
Forum Contributor
 
Gaffboat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: United States
First Name: Oliver
Posts: 2,090
 
Default

If the wood breaking down with exposure is a problem why not just the seal the whole thing with a thin coat of epoxy? The wood will still show through but it will be pretty impervious to the weather. The only major issue might be the epoxy breaking down from uv exposure. An alternative would be to use some marine varnish like Cetol to seal everything. That's what I used on my mast and other exposed wood when I built a sailboat. In any event, this sounds like a fun project and I'm looking forward to seeing photos of the finished piece, especially in situ.
vchiarelli likes this.

Dragons slain. Damsels rescued. No reasonable request refused ... unless the dragon's really big.

Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. ~ Leonardo da Vinci

You can't use up creativity. The more you use, the more you have. ~Oscar Wilde

http://profhenrys.blogspot.com
Gaffboat is offline  
post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 03:25 PM
Forum Contributor
 
Stick486's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Country: United States
First Name: Stick
Posts: 25,287
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaffboat View Post
If the wood breaking down with exposure is a problem why not just the seal the whole thing with a thin coat of epoxy? The wood will still show through but it will be pretty impervious to the weather. The only major issue might be the epoxy breaking down from uv exposure. An alternative would be to use some marine varnish like Cetol to seal everything. That's what I used on my mast and other exposed wood when I built a sailboat. In any event, this sounds like a fun project and I'm looking forward to seeing photos of the finished piece, especially in situ.
I would worry more about the heat exposure separating the cedar's wood fibers and grain...
Herb Stoops likes this.

This would have been the week that I'd have finished chewing thru the restraints...
If only new layers hadn't been added....

Stick....
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"SNORK Mountain Congressional Library and Taxidermy”
Stick486 is online now  
post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 06:56 PM
Forum Contributor
 
Herb Stoops's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Country: United States
First Name: Herb
Posts: 7,403
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stick486 View Post
I would worry more about the heat exposure separating the cedar's wood fibers and grain...
I agree with Stick, treat the wood and use bolts like was previously stated ,don't waste time with any glue.

Herb
Herb Stoops is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Router Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Using router for glue up Mickeyt Table-mounted Routing 26 01-18-2016 11:21 AM
Router Table Top Glue Matthew C Smith Table-mounted Routing 18 05-03-2014 11:06 PM
Hide Glue Daikusan Tools and Woodworking 9 02-11-2014 07:47 AM
DC Question angus Lobby 3 03-31-2008 08:29 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome